GET READY FOR A LONG READ.. BUT HEY ITLL SAVE YOU TIME AND MONEY IN THE END...

ok im sure you can just google the title to this thread, and get plenty of advice, but i was a new/used car salesman before i got in the army, and my father has been in the business for over 20 years. ill tell you everything i know about what you should do.. and if you still have any questions please ask them. hopefully this will get stickied and save some people money on that new vehicle they have been dreaming about.

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buying a NEW car/truck

ok once you know what you want, you need to get as informed as you can about every option thats available. adjustable pedals? heated seats? cold weather package (block heater/battery warmer)?

know what options you want. know what you can live with, and what you cant live without with your new purchase. theres nothing worse than buying a new car and realizing later you really should have gone with the adjustable pedals because if your wife moves the seat up one more time your gonna rip your hair out lol.

you can find actual option codes on each option. find them online, either at there manufacturers website, or just google it. if you know the actual code for the option you sound more informed, and the salesman is alot more likely to respect that it will show in the sales price.

now that you know what you want... heres secret number one.. well its not really a secret, but not alot of people know this. this is for NEW cars/trucks only..... if theres a truck with option package A,B,and C.. and you know you want it... theres absoultely no reason to drive 3 hours away to get a better deal. its pointless. EVERY DEALER CAN SELL THE VEHICLE FOR THE SAME PRICE. theres no dealer that can make you a better deal than any other dealer. the window stickers and vehicle invoices come straight from the manufacturer, not the dealer. yes some dealers might charge a $300 dollar "dealer fee" to include detailing the vechicle, processing paperwork, etc... and another dealer might charge a 150$ dealer fee. but dont worry about that. just worry about the bottom line - MSRP, and the INVOICE.

secret number two... how the salesmen get paid. most new car dealers are the same. the salesman get a minimum amount every week, bi-week, or monthly check. if they dont sell enough cars to make enough commission to surpass that amount, the minimum amount is still there so they dont get depresses and commit suicide lol. comissions are usually based on how much profit on average the salesman makes for the cars he sells for that month. there will be different brackets for profits. if he avg. $500 a sale total profit for the month, he might get %X amount comission on that profit. if he averages $3000 per sale he will get %Y amount comission on that profit.

i can tell you from experience that the highest percentage i made was %28 percent. i can also tell you that the highest profit on a vehicle i made was a little over $8000. so take %28 of $8000 and calculate it yourself. yep. pretty crazu huh? if you sell a car for under a certain amount of profit, its called a ''mini-deal, or mini''. you usually get a set amount of commission for it, around 100 bucks.

that guy came in, bought a fully loaded brand new suburban 4x4, was a "lay down" (means he didnt even try to haggle on price, just took his rebates and signed right up), and i also sold him an aftermarket video system- headrest screens and a flip down, and lojack.

ill remember that day for the rest of my life.


anyhoo.. back on track..

 

thats the comission for the floor salesman. thats the guy who is waiting for you when you get out of your car. he will usually walk right up to you.


lets talk a little about the guy i want you to find. the FLEET SALESMAN, or INTERNET SALESMAN. both can do the same type of deal for you.

fleet and internet sales is a different animal. they make comission based on how many cars per month they sell. usually every single one of their sales is a mini, but like i said, they get paid on volume. i worked with one internet guy that averaged 15 cars a month. doesnt sound like much if you think about how they were all mini deals, (1500 bucks comission for the month) but with his internet volume bonus, this guy was pulling around 8-10k a month. yep.

so an internet salesman, or fleet salesman, will be more than willing to show you an invoice as soon as you email them, or as soon as you walk in. they are perfectly ok with not making any money selling you the car. they want that volume bonus.

if you email an internet salesman the option codes you want, color codes you want, he can find you usually one or more vehicles he has in his inventory (however many dealerships his company owns) and if its not on the lot, he can get it in a matter of days. and no you dont have to commit to buy it in order for him to get it.

so you definately want to seek out the internet sales guy. just ask for internet sales when you call or go in. or fleet. that guy can work the same deal.

floor salesman will be alot less likely to just throw an invoice in your face, because they want to maximize those profits, and they have a sales manager pressuring them to sell for as much as possible

 

now lets talk about what everyone wants to know... price!

its as easy as this.

THE CHEAPEST YOU CAN BUY A CAR FOR IS INVOICE PRICE. there it is. no haggling. no sales manager. just like that. get the invoice. theres your price. and the best part is, whatever rebates you qualify for, come out of the final deal AFTER the sale price has been established.

so if your buying a truck with a MSRP for $37,000 and the invoice price is $30,000, and you qualify for a $3000 rebate, guess what your sales price is?

$27,000.

yep. thats something to be proud of.

look up all the current rebates online. the salesmen will usually tell you, but hey everyone has brainfarts now and then. the rebates do not affect the sales comission in any way, so they have no reason to hide the rebates from you. they do change alot, and sometimes they can forget a new one.

one good one people always find out about too late is the brand loyalty rebate. like if you currently own a chevy, or are trading in a chevy, and can show proof, you get an extra $500 rebate. or most manufacturers have a $500 military rebate as well.

so there you go. yep price really is that simple.

oh and also know that every part of the car will have a msrp/retail.

like the leather seat option, or ''loaded package option'' might be an extra $2500 on the window sticker, but the invoice will show you that the invoice price for that option might be $1900 or something. so you do save there too, so it might be worth getting those extra options your thinking of skimping out on.

 

ok next ill go over the actual "deal". this wont include sales price, i already went over that.

im just going to touch on trade ins, down payments, payments, and financing.


the MOST IMPORTANT thing to remember, especially if your NOT going to the internet manager or sales manager (why wouldnt you? you dont trust me? lol) is that the dealer is in business to make money. the salesman, sales manager, finance guy, manager, owner... they all make money based on how much money they make off of you. sad but true. love it or hate it. its the nature of the car business.


this is more for floor sales...
so when they tell you the sales price, and its the sticker price, dont get pissed. i used to have a sales manager who would make me do the initial deal as sticker price reguardless of if the customer knew the invoice or not. i had to write it up, then put at the bottom- if terms can be reached i will buy todayX___________ and have them sign it. its called a "commitment". its not legally binding of course, but many people wont sign if they arent ready to buy, and a sales manager isnt going to waste his time if you arent ready to buy today. so i would just explain.. hey i know you told me you want to pay X amount, but i have to write this up a certain way first..

same thing with the payment. EVERYONE wants a $300 payment. i never talked to anyone who said "oh hey, i want a 900 dollar payment" lol. so when the salesman comes back and the payment says $700 and you just told him 30 mins ago you want to pay $300, dont get pissed.

its all barganing. they expect you to talk them down. so they arent going to offer you anything even close to the real deal until they know your serious.

down payment is no different. the first offer from the sales manager would usually say - $5000 down, $700 a month, $30,000.... when the customer really wants all those numbers to be much less.

all the first offer is, is another commitment. no matter what you say, payments dont really matter here. depends on your intrest rate, which depends on your credit and down payment. the down payment doesnt matter. you have what you have. if you dont want to put down $7000 nobody is going to make you lol.

the price of the car is usually sticker at this point too.

the point of all this is also to get you to focus on the ultra high payment, and the down payment you dont have, and the crappy amount they are offering for your trade. the more you worry about these numbers, they hope you will worry less about the price of the car.

in reality that should be your main concern at this point, and ive already given you the tools you need there.

 

trade in...

dealers know you dont want to mess with selling to an individual. you have to advertise it. you have to clean it up. you have to sell it before you buy your new car. they know all this.

so they will prey upon that and try to get away with offering you as little as possible for your car, and then sending it to auction, or putting it on the used lot.

the biggest mistake ive seen customers make is KELLEY BLUE BOOK. everyone uses that thing as a bible. well guess who doesnt.. CAR DEALERS! they use the NADA guide, and they even come in a convienient little pocket size book, so the used car manager who is going to be the one appraising your trade can have it right there.

so dont go by the blue book value when you want to trade in, because youll just be disappointed.

but do remember if you have followed my guide they are already NOT going to be making much at all on you on the new car, so theyre gonna try to make as much as possible on the trade.

always try to sell it to an individual. youll get more. period. craigslist is free. use it.

if not, then pick a minimum amount your willing to take for your trade, than subtract 1000 bucks and think about it for a few days. just prepare yourself and decide what you want to do.

 

and lastly... finance. my dad has been in finance for a while.

if you have good credit you dont have much to worry about.

if you have bad credit you kinda sol, because in order to get financed you might have to take a higher rate, and settle for a cheaper vehicle, or a used vehicle, or put down a ton of cash to make up the difference.

one thing i highly reccomend is applying for a new/used car loan from your bank or credit union.

they will preapprove you for a rate, and an amount. take that to the dealer, and they will usually meet or beat it for you. plus youll be prepared on payment so you can just laugh when they offer you the inital deal.

 

AND LASTLY

dont go into the dealership thinking you know everything. if anything just pretend you know nothing.

i go with friends all the time to help them buy cars. and i dont mention im an ex-salesman.

i dont say a word until the final sit down to do the deal. then i take over, get the vehicle for invoice plus rebates, and get my buddy out happy.

i usually charge them lunch lol.

if this helps you please post up with how it helped and what kind of deal you got.


i also found this..

http://www.edmunds.com/advice/buying...2/article.html

another guy did what i did, posted up some secrets. only he did a better job i think.. i dont have the attention span to write that much, plus my sons cartoon music is driving me bonkers and i cant concentrate lmao

 

Hey thanks,an interesting thread.Am always interested in learning more from someone on the inside.It all helps!

 

Great Post! It should help alot of people. One area you didn't cover is pricing of extended warranties. I plan on ordering a Platinum in the next couple of months and keeping it for a minimum of 10 years; also, I need the extended warranty since I know nothing about how to fix them myself. Typically what type of discount, or percentage off, can a consumer begin to negoiate off of an extended warranty at the time of purchasing a new truck? In the past, I purchased a car and the dealer told me the priced is fixed and refused to negoiate price. Is this usually the case or is there haggle room here, too?

 

good question. im not sure about that, because the finance department sells the warranty, and i never worked in there.

ill call my dad (has been in the finance department 15 years now), so he should know

 

Thank you. Any help you can provide is greatly appreciated. One final question - I believe I can get a truck for invoice price without much difficulty (I live in New Jersey). Like your post stated, should I feel fortunate to get invoice price, or try and negogiate somewhere between invoice and x-plan? I am not eligible for x-plan unless I solicited a pin number from someone on this board and they were kind enough to give me one.

 

Something you might use as leverage is that there are aftermarket warranty companies...shop their price and that may give you leverage with the finance guy to lower his price. They are ususally pretty fired up to sell that warranty during the initial sales transaction...so your leverage is going to be best at that point ane he'll probably be willing to discount...good luck!!

 

hotlap was spot on. you just have to shop the warranty before hand. thats the thing everyone always forgets. they get the deal done then go sit in finance... yes even if you pay cash you have to go to the finance office to at least decline extended warranty..

if you can get a pin for xplan go for it. the fleet or net sales guy shouldnt hassle you. if not go for invoice.

 

speepdaedeesi,

You have been very helpful. The information you posted in reference to buying a car/truck will be helpful to many people, I'm sure. I know it must have taken you a very long time to provide all of the information; it will certainly make us, as consumers, that much more informed when we sit down to finalize a deal.

Its not every day you find an honest sales person - Too bad your no longer in car and truck sales.

After I order my truck, I will respond back and let you know the results.

 

i was pretty nice while i was in sales, but i do admit if you werent nice to me, you werent getting a good deal.

my case in point....

an old couple walked in one day (in their 60s). the woman did most of the talking. i tried making small talk with the old guy and he called me a "car peddler".

then he said not to bother talking to him because he was going to get the best price and he would walk out if he didnt.


so long story short, they wanted a fully loaded impala.

they had a certain payment in mind. dont worry about price here.

i down graded them to a malibu (cheaper) so i could still get them fully loaded, but still charge them sticker price.

i gave them a $3000 rebate.

they paid sticker for the car.

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another story..

this guy comes in, and tells me he has spent weeks looking for a deal on a new truck but cant find a dealer willing to get the right price. i explain that all dealers get the trucks for the same price, and can sell for the same price.

what price does he have in mind?

he looked up the invoice online and also read somewhere that no matter what car he was looking at, to get it for $3000 less...

so this guy wanted it for $3000 under invoice.

of course i said no problem. we can sell it to you for invoice, and then give you an extra 3000 rebate, but he knew already that the manufacturer pays the dealer back the rebate, so he wanted the rebate taken off after the 3000 under invoice.

after showing him invoices, letting him talk to all my managers, etc... we just couldnt come to a conclusion.

he was very rude, and just had it set in his head that he was getting it for that price.

i calmly asked him "sir, you came here today to get a good buy?"

he says " yes! and his eyes light up, thinking he has gotten the deal."

i say " well here it is!!!! GOOD BYE!"



needless to say he called and filed a complaint a few days later, but i only got high fives related to it lol.

you really have to educate yourself when buying a new vehicle.

ON BRAND NEW VEHICLES..... THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A GOOD DEAL. YOU EITHER KNOW THE ROCK BOTTOM PRICE, OR YOU DONT.

I HATE IT WHEN PEOPLE SAY THEY GOT A GOOD DEAL, OR THEY WANT A GOOD DEAL.

THERE IS NO GOOD DEAL.

YOU DECIDE HOW MUCH EXTRA YOU PAY.