Hey all,

I don't mean to start up a Z vs. M debate, but I got a little question about swirls on my black supercab...

I'm going to try some zaino to get me through the harsh midwest winter and I've read that Z5 swirl remover doesn't really remove swirls but sort of tries to hide them - and that it's possible the swirls/imperfections could be enhanced when I've applied the Z, correct?

Also, I've read many good things here about Meguiars #9 swirl remover, and wanted to verify that this product actually removes the swirls and doesn't just cover them up like the Z5, correct?

So what I'm getting at is this: If I use the #9 to remove swirls, I could then dawn wash, claybar, and do the Z treatment and the swirls would be taken care of (i.e. not just covered but removed) and the Z wouldn't have a problem bonding to the paint?

Just trying to get the best of both QUALITY products.

Now, RP and XLT - fight nice

 

not sure about meguires or zaino, i've used 3m swirl remover a couple of times and have been exceptionally satisfied with the results. Its just one of those things you have to have an electric buffer for tho.

The instructions said to do small areas at a time, i decided to be quick about it i would do one panel at a time. By the time i was at the end of the first panel the part where i started was impossible to buff out (this is all by hand). I spent about 1 hour doing the first panel, rest took about another hour. So just follow the directions.

Now i wanna see rockpick and xlt fight

 

To be perfectly honest, as I always am I would say that Z5 will not do much for you with swirls. One of Zaino’s main claims is their polish contains “no” abrasives and in my opinion that means no swirl removal properties.

I personally do not know just how well the Z5 would work to cover up swirls as compared to Meguiars products. Before using an abrasive product you could try some Z5, at least three coats and see how well it works, and then try some Meguiars (don’t know which one) for swirl removal and see what works best for you.

I can say the experience I have with any Zaino product that “claimed” to remove scratches is their window polish. It works awesome for getting the window nice and clean like brand new, but it did NOT remove the little scratch I have in the lower corner. Now that product “claimed” to remove scratches in the window and it did not touch the slight little one I have.

Hopefully someone will come along with more experience with the Z5 and may be able to give you better information, or perhaps tell you that it worked for them, but from all my reading I have heard no one claim that the Z5 actually helped with the swirls…

Now once you get rid of them and as long as it is with a product that does NOT contain any wax residue you could Zaino after. If the product you use has any polish in it for the swirl removal you would not be able to use Zaino because Zaino has to have a wax “free” surface to bond to.

 

Where's that **** RockPick anyway????

 

Graphic,

I've always heard that Meg's Dual Action Cleaner Polish (#83) or Meg's Swirl Free Polish (#82) are the products that are aggresive enough to actually remove those fine swirl marks with a PC (unless you just want a really good workout). I also believe that Meg's #9 and #7 have more fillers then compounding agents which I personally don't mind. A good way to tell if you are actually removing swirls marks or just hiding them is to wipe down the area you just polished with a 50/50 mix of water and isopropyl alcohol. It will remove the oils and fillers and let you see the true condition of the paint.

My friend that runs a body shop is partial to 3M's Swirl Mark Remover. There is one for lighter colors (3M-39109) and one for darker color vehicles (3M-39009). I believe the difference has something to do with the dyes that they use.

chknbone

 

thanks for the info guys. seems to be pretty much on target with what I was thinking.

XLT, I was thinking I didn't want to go through the zaino only to have it enhance the swirls and then need to go back to meguiars...since you can't strip the z with dawn I didn't know if the meguiars would be able to go right over top of it or I would have to wait for the Z to break down.

I'm off to bed for tonight :o - I'll see what RP has to say tomorrow but I'm guessing we're all thinking along the same lines here.

As a side note - I've got an email in to Sal Zaino asking about the discrepancy between his product labels and web site instructions (one claiming to use a circular motion to apply product, another just says use up & down motions) I'll let you know when I get a response.

Thanks again all.

 

Graphic,

I would agree with 01............ the Z5 will do little to cover up (it will not remove) swirls. As chknbone said, there are better products to remove swirls. However, I would not use any of the products that tend to remove & hide swirls with fillers and oils (like #9, #7), and then try and top with the Z. The #9 will remove some of the swirls, and "hide" some with it's oils. The #7 will not remove any swirls, but will hide them somemore with it's oils too.

Anyhow, if you use those products, after you wash, double check to see if any of the swirls are re-appearing. If so, I would use the DACP to physically "remove" the swirls, then start the Z process.

On a side note, I use Poorboy's Pro Polish, and SSR1 swirl remover under Z with washing after polishing, as there are no waxes or silicones in them to act as fillers. They are water based, and seem to be very compatible with Z. As a matter of fact, they are my paint cleaner/SMR's of choice for all products.

Hope this helps!

 

I'm here... I just don't have anything to add so I'm keeping quiet...

I don't know about the compatibility between M and Z so, I'm lurking so that I can learn a bit...

RP

 

Good to see you…

I thought I read before that one could use Zaino with Meguiars. However the Meguiars would have to be the top coat with Zaino as the foundation, for that matter any type of “wax” would have to be on top of Zaino.

Personally I would think that would just be overkill since both Zaino and Meguiars alone will produce an excellent shine.

Anyway I am way out of my league on this question of the two being compatible I am only referring to something I “think” I read once. So I would wait to see what someone with actual experience has to say…

The important thing to remember about Zaino is the paint surface has to be free of any oil and wax in order for it to bond to the paint and produce a good shine.

 

I would agree with that statement, and I'm willing to bet that Sal would insist that is the case!

Having said that, I've heard of people using Meguiar's polishes prior to Zaino with some success........... depending on their version of success? Still, for the most part, I believe it's best to follow a system, or at least use products that should be compatible................. and waxes, oils, and silicones are known not to be compatible with polymer sealants...... at least when it comes to bonding (durability).

A while back, a "highly regarded" individual on another Truck website remarked that Zaino was an OK product, but it wasn't as good as brand "X". I remembered trying to convice this individual to use the complete Zaino system. To save a few bucks he felt that Gold Class Car wash was OK to use with "Z", and the Z1 shouldn't be necessary as his current paint cleaner worked good, and his current Meguiar's QD should be fine. Of course, then he complained about "various" problems he had with the "Z".

Anyhow, when people like that bad mouth, or recommend a product............... it just ticks me off!

Then again, it's only wax and stuff!

 

Yep... it irritates me too...

Just like Intel486 taught us a long time ago...

Find a product that yields the results that YOU want and stick with it.

 

Yep, definately something I learned from everyone here in the first week that I lurked the boards before signing up as a member : )

Also brings me to say something I've been meaning to say to RockPick: hope you don't feel betrayed that I'm trying out the Z - especially after the amazing effort you put into answering my Meguiars questions. Don't get me wrong, I've still got about 5 or 6 Meg's products that I use in my routine, but in the end I want to be able to get through the harsh midwest winter and not feel too guilty that I can't put in as much time on the truck as I'd like.

and thanks again for the insight on this post - whenever I finally get a decent weekend I think I've got my routine ready to go.

later-
Graphic

 

It's okay man... I understand. Z is a good product that definately has the durability to last through a rough winter. I liked it when I tried it but just couldn't convince myself that I was really coming out on top. In short, it was going to limit my time waxing my truck and out of the house (which, honestly, I enjoy) so, I continue to stick with my old stand by...

And, if all goes well, I will be featured in the next Meguiar's catalog under 'featured vehicles'. Yep... you heard me right...
It's preliminary right now but, I think I've finally caught someone's attention at Meguiar's Corporate...

RP

 

That's awesome RP! I just got my first Meg's catalog in the mail on Thursday and I'm dying to order some MF towels and such!

Let us know how it pans out. I've mentioned to both Meg's and Z when I've phoned/ordered that the people on this board were major proponents of their products (didn't name names specifically, cuz I only know y'all by your handles)

Anyway - congrats! Keep up the good work!

 

Hey ROCKPICK....... Sound like your only problem is IN the house ...........LOL

That reminds me of a previous post I made about getting something you liked polishing more than your truck.....