Several firsts for me. First first, finally got that F150 5.4L 4x4 Screw. You can't believe how long I have been waiting (first truck also). Second first, this is my first post. This is a great board - I have learned lots from all of you. I have some questions and want to tap into your brainpower.
Although I am satisfied with the 260 stock ponies of the 5.4L, I naturally want more. From all the great info in these threads, here is what I plan:
1. Will get the Superchip. Will contact Mike T. soon.
2. Will get a new cat-back system. Probably the Ravin Z55.
3. Will get a purchased (not good at home made) improved air intake system, probably the K&N Gen II.
From the threads, the above seem to give the biggest bang for the buck. However, I am considering others also:
4. Granatelli Mass Airflow Sensor
5. Throttle body spacer
6. Power Pullies
Questions.
a. Is the K&N Gen II worth the money, or are there better systems out there in your opinion?
b. Mike T., should I keep the stock thermostat, or is a cooler thermostat (160 or 180 deg) better for the performance with the superchip, or is it not sensitive to this?
c. In yall's opinions, is the improved mass air flow system a waste of money? What about the throttle body spacer?
d. Seems like the power pullies will free up some HP. Which system is the best for the 5.4L?
Sorry for so many questions. Thanks in advance for all of your very respected opinions. When I have the mods complete, I will post the results.
GoDogGo

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2001 SuperCrew, 5.4, 4x4

 

Hi GoDogGo,

Welcome to F-150 Online!

Looks like you've been doing some homework on your proposed mods, good for you.

I personally wouldn't spend money on an aftermarket mass air flow sensor, simply because they don't add any appreciable power from an airflow standpoint, and they may well require a custom program to compensate for their leaning out the A/F mixture. Before you can make more power from a larger MAF (mass airflow sensor) or throttle body, the engine has to be modified to the point that it can actually make *use* of additional airflow. We have a number of *supercharged* F-150's running the stock MAF & throttle bodies, just to give you an idea. Now on a supercharged motor I would be more inclined to increase the size of those components, as there you have a considerable increase in airflow & power of course from the supercharger, but I personally wouldn't do this without a supercharger, as they just don't show the gains on the dyno. One exception is that a larger throttle body can show gains of 3-5 hp when used with the stock restrictive factory airbox & paper air filter element, this happens just due to reduction of restriction. But use a K&N air filter, or an airbox elimination kit, and out the window goes that power gain from the larger throttle body.

I can't tell you about the throttle body spacer, as we haven't done true back-to-back dyno testing on that part as has been done on some of the more popular bolt-ons, as part of the developement work over the years that Superchips does in coming up with their new programs for these vehicles.

A good 3-piece set of underdrive pullies (ASP, FOrd Motorsports, etc.) is worth just shy of 12 hp at the rear wheels on either the 5.4 F-150; though they of course don't actually increase the engine's power output techncially speaking, they do decrease parasitic losses from turning those accessories and thus send more power to the rear wheels, so they are indeed a worthwhile mod.

We like the airbox elimination kits, either K&N's FIPK kit or the Airaid brand cost the same, and make virtually identical power gains, they're worth about 14 hp on the 5.4 motor. The Airaid brand has a bit more stable mounting system, and to me personally, though this is highly subjective, I think the power-coated metal air tube of the Airaid unit looks better, where the K&N unit uses their phenolic resin-based black plastic air tube. K&N has the California emissions cert., and if memory serves, the Airaid's CARB cert. was still pending last I heard, but that may have changed by now.

Bottom line is, either of those 2 manufacturer's airbox elimination kits are a good mod that you'll be happy with, I'm sure.

Now with regards to using a colder thermostat, in a word, don't. Your engine makes it's best power and gets it's best fuel mileage when the coolant temperature is between 190 and 200 degrees. Most factory thermostats on these Fords are 194 degrees, some are 190-192. Using a colder thermostat can cause any number of problems, most of them long-term, such as increased accumulation of combustion chamber deposits. You could drop to a 180 degree unit if you wanted to, but don't go any lower, would be my advice. If it were me, I wouldn't change it at all.

I hope that info helps a bit, and best of luck with your truck!

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Mike Troyer
Performance Products, Inc.
National Distributor of Superchips
(540) 862-9515
Email: mtroyer@compuserve.com
Performance Products F150Online Superchip ordering system: F150Online Superchip Ordering System
First National F-150 Online Rally Event Organizer

 

Mike,

Excellent advice. I appreciate and respect the knowledge you have shared with me. FYI, I got a Ravin Z55 installed this afternoon - I just couldn't stand sitting around any longer. Great sound and very noticable improvement in HP to me. Next up is either the Airaid or K&N Gen II, and the chip. Mike, I will try and contact you within the next couple of days to order a chip and discuss some technical aspects, etc.

For the benefit of the other readers, I will discuss my experience with the Ravin cat-back system. Believe it or not, my primary reason for choosing the Ravin was based upon several of the experiences and posts on this board, by F150aGoGo, et.al. - thanks guys.
Now for my experience. First off, the Ravin is very new here in Houston. Several of the Midas shops I called were either not up to speed on it, did not have any systems yet, or had just recieved them only hours earlier and were not even knowledgable about the product and the pricing. One shop I called said the following, and I quote "...this is embarassing when the customer knows more about the product than the dealer does ...". Another shop I called said "...sure, we can install that system for you. We just got the first order in today. Your installed cost excluding taxes will be $450...." Naturally I graciously declined. However, as F150aGoGo said, you have to keep looking till you find someone who is up to speed and you are comfortable with. Finally found a guy, knew what he was talking about, was close to home, had been selling Ravins for several weeks and had installed many of them, and was a fellow F150 nut. His price was $275, probably $25 or so more than I could have got if I spent another 2 hours banging the phone calling Midas shops looking for a better deal. But by this time I was tired of the phone, and I was very comfortable with the shop manager. Moral, as with anything else, shop around. Insofar as the system is concerned, I loved it as soon as I turned the engine over. Again based upon the specific advice and experiences of several posts here, I went with the single in dual out swept back Z55 system (moderately aggressive) instead of the Z70 system (least aggressive) or the Z30 system (most aggressive). If not for those other posts, I probably would have gone for the Z70 with a single in-single out. The growl is a little louder than I expected, but only during acceleration, otherwise very pleasing to the ear.
I can't wait to install the new air intake system and the chip. A little later for the power pullies.
GoDogGo

 

GoDogGo,

Care to post a wav file so I can hear that R55? I am really interested.
G-

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2001 SCrew Lariat, 5.4L, 4x4, Arizona Beige, CD, Leather 60/40, Skids, Slider, 3.55LS, Tow Package, Block Heater. Future Mods: Plastic Bed Liner, Westin Chromed Stainless Step Bars, Front Hitch, Warn semi-hidden winch. Bed Cap. K&N Filter

 

GoDogGo,
I see a lot of posts right now about this ravin system.How loud is it next to the oem system. I have the gibson and it sounds about stock.
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1997 F150 XLT
Debut sport truck
Ext. cab short bed
4.6l 3.55ls Auto
*K&N filter
*Gibson swept side
*superchip
*rancho RS9000


[This message has been edited by ALLFORD (edited 10-12-2000).]

 

ALLFORD,

I have the Z55 in my 2001 SCrew and love the sound. As for your concern about being too loud on long trips, I haven't found that to be a problem. At cruise speeds it is hardly louder than stock. When you stomp on the pedal is when you get the nice growl...not to mention the added power.

Ryne


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SuperCrew, Lariat, 5.4, moonroof, bed extender, Line-X, Westin Nerf Bars, Ravin Z55 Exhaust, more to come...

 

Ryne

Thanks for the info. From all the good posts on the ravin it sounds like the way to go. It's just hard to talk myself into pulling a system that I just put on.

 

ALLFORD.... I can't believe your trading in your Gibson Swept Side system. If your looking for more HP and torque out of another exhaust system...your not going to find it. After all the research I have done on exhaust in the last few months...the Gibson "Swept Side" provides the best HP and torque gains on the market. The Ravin is also a good product, but about the only thing you are going to gain is NOISE, you may even lose HP/torque and years of experience and knowledge behind the Gibson name.

The sound behind the Gibson "Swept Side" may not be as loud as a lot of other aftermarket exhaust systems...but it does provide the best HP and torque gains out there.

Someone will be along here soon to argue this point...If your looking for POWER gains then Gibson "Swept Side" is about the best, if your looking for sound then Ravin is where you want to be.

 

ALLFORD...good to hear that you have decided to keep your Gibson "Swept Side", they are a great system and you will not find any better for increasing HP and Torque. The Ravin has been getting some great press here on this site but does this make them better you may ask....NOT!!!

Gibson has been making exhaust products for many more years than Midas/Raven.....Practice makes perfect they say!

I own a 2001 SuperCrew 4x4 (4.6L) and love it this truck. Sure it may have the smaller V8 stuffed in it, but for what I need it for (pulling snowmobile/sport bike trailers, 20'skiboat and buddies) it does me just fine and have never looked back in not buying a 5.4L. These new Triton motors (4.6 & 5.4) really work well and if down the road I need to pull some really big loads then V10/POWERSTROKER will be on the top of my list!!!

I just ordered a Superchip from Mike Troyer this morning...I think all Ford trucks lack in tranmission power loss and the chip will fix this up!!

Even the the 5.4L boys do these kind of thing so there!

 

To tell you the truth, I bet if you did an actual side-by-side comparison of all the top three or four cat-back systems (comparing their similar product models) you wouldn't find a significant difference between them in terms of performance gains. The most noticable difference I feel is the sound. Just my personal opinion and 2 cents worth. All I can say is that I definitely felt the increase in power and torque and I bet the increases would not have been that much different with another comperable system such as Gibson, etc.
GoDogGo

 

I got the gibson because it looked like it was the best system for towing and not too loud. I do some towing and havn't seen much on that with a ravin exhaust.

[This message has been edited by ALLFORD (edited 10-12-2000).]

 

Allford,

would you say that the Gibson swept side is louder than stock?

G-

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2001 SCrew Lariat, 5.4L, 4x4, Arizona Beige, CD, Leather 60/40, Skids, Slider, 3.55LS, Tow Package, Block Heater. Future Mods: Plastic Bed Liner, Westin Chromed Stainless Step Bars, Front Hitch, Warn semi-hidden winch. Bed Cap. K&N Filter

 

On my 4.6l it is about the same as stock. It is just a bit louder and the tone is deeper. I think it is getting more of both with some miles on it now. I think I have around 6,000 miles on it.
Towing and going on trips I don't want a loud exhaust just some growl. I guess I will just keep the gibson for now.

If your thinking about a gibson like 2001 said it has been shown to give the best torque numbers and good hp. The ravin is just getting a lot of good press right now for its sound. Price on the gibson was around $269 from summit racing.

BTW I am going down to gatlinburg in the next week or so. The first 3 trips stock was 21.5 mpg I hope to hit 24 now. With the superchip I hit 23.5 going to gettysburg so I think I can do it this time.



[This message has been edited by ALLFORD (edited 10-12-2000).]

 

If I may add a point here, I would agree that the majority of the good "name-brand" cat-back systems produce roughly the same basic horsepower gains, 10-12 hp on the 4.6, and 10-14 hp on the 5.4 in the F-150's, roughly.

Where there are differences is in the shape of the torque curve. Some systems can cause you to lose some low-rpm torque, while producing nice hp gains at higher rpms, and that is why we generally advise in these heavy trucks to use a system that has been flow-engineered for towing, such as one of the Gibson models, and I don't remember the model name, sorry.

Controlling the effects on the timing of the exhaust pulse waves is a real science & art, above my head admittedly.

Most of the cat-back systems that have traditionally been reported back here as working the best are usually single systems that are 2.5" - 3" in pipe diameter on the V-8 F-150's.

It never hurts to talk direclty to the manufacturers themselves, so you can get a feel for how they engineered the system, what considerations and/or priorities they used in designing the system, etc.

------------------
Mike Troyer
Performance Products, Inc.
National Distributor of Superchips
(540) 862-9515
Email: mtroyer@compuserve.com
Performance Products F150Online Superchip ordering system: F150Online Superchip Ordering System
First National F-150 Online Rally Event Organizer

 

I beleive 2001 is incorrect in saying the Gibson sideswept makes the most hp/torque, in the sites I visited that sell the sideswept it says not recomended for towing which I do. So I visited my local muffler shop and talked with the guy and he recomended the Magnaflow muffler and 3" pipe which he grafted from the y back for only $250 installed. It has a nice deep rumble at idle, and when you open it up it roars, but is not loud at cruising speed unless you go to pass. He does the instalations for 4x4 warehouse and says the Gibsons never fit right they always have to rebend and cut to fit. For the sake of an extra horse or two is it really worth another $250, that's what 4x4 warehouse quoted me with installation on the gibson.

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'97 F150 4.6L XL WHITE,FLEETSIDE R/C L/B, LEER SHELL W/FISHING POLE RACK, BED MAT,LIMMITED SLIP,245/75/16 DESERT DOGS ON POLISHED ALUM, WHEELS.
AIRAID, 3" CAT BACK OUT THE SIDE w/MAGNAFLOW MUFFER