Chevy Avalanche
#16
06-30-2001, 03:37 PM
Former Sponsor
Hi 4X4,
Thanks for your post.
However, you're looking a numbers on paper, and in the real world, it doesn't perform up to those numbers, in my humble opinion. The PSD and the Duramax share the same 505 peak torque rating, but the PSD feels noticeably stronger, I think. We may have a case of a bit of an inflated rating, it wouldn't be the first time an automaker did that, over the years just about all of them have from time to time.
It's also an unproven engine (as Ron mentioned) from a manufacturer with a *terrible* track record in consumer diesel engines, so it's going to take a few years before we see if this new Duramax is really up to the job. There's no doubt that it's a better effort than their past motor, you bet! But it's going to take a few years for it to prove itself to be in the same category with the well-proven Powerstroke diesel. As I said in another post, I hope for GM's and their customer's sake that it turns out to be a great motor!
------------------
Mike Troyer
Performance Products, Inc.
National Distributor of Superchips
(540) 862-9515
Email: mtroyer@compuserve.com
Performance Products F150Online Superchip ordering system: F150Online Superchip Ordering System
National F-150 Online Rally Event Organizer
[This message has been edited by Superchips_Distributor (edited 06-30-2001).]
Thanks for your post.
However, you're looking a numbers on paper, and in the real world, it doesn't perform up to those numbers, in my humble opinion. The PSD and the Duramax share the same 505 peak torque rating, but the PSD feels noticeably stronger, I think. We may have a case of a bit of an inflated rating, it wouldn't be the first time an automaker did that, over the years just about all of them have from time to time.
It's also an unproven engine (as Ron mentioned) from a manufacturer with a *terrible* track record in consumer diesel engines, so it's going to take a few years before we see if this new Duramax is really up to the job. There's no doubt that it's a better effort than their past motor, you bet!
But it's going to take a few years for it to prove itself to be in the same category with the well-proven Powerstroke diesel. As I said in another post, I hope for GM's and their customer's sake that it turns out to be a great motor!------------------
Mike Troyer
Performance Products, Inc.
National Distributor of Superchips
(540) 862-9515
Email: mtroyer@compuserve.com
Performance Products F150Online Superchip ordering system: F150Online Superchip Ordering System
National F-150 Online Rally Event Organizer
[This message has been edited by Superchips_Distributor (edited 06-30-2001).]
#17
06-30-2001, 04:47 PM
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Good lord,I just saw one of those things on the road a week or two ago. I saw one at the Tx State fair in Dallas,but it still did not prepare me for the absolute horror I experienced seeing one on the road. BRRRRRRR!!!!! Jesus,what an ugly vehicle! I'm still recovering from the shock,,,,,98
ps: I'm talking about the Avalanche,of course,lol.
------------------
98 F-150 4.6 Litre XLT 4x2 Ext. cab
prarie tan/tan int.
Yep,it has alot of stuff installed on it,I just got sick of lugging that huge sig. around,hehe
Come and see my newest pictures@ www.my-f150.com
Everything is shown there,except for the Superchip,Thanks Mike T!!
FENDER GUITARS ROCK!!!
Now,if it only looked like this in real life
ps: I'm talking about the Avalanche,of course,lol.
------------------
98 F-150 4.6 Litre XLT 4x2 Ext. cab
prarie tan/tan int.
Yep,it has alot of stuff installed on it,I just got sick of lugging that huge sig. around,hehe
Come and see my newest pictures@ www.my-f150.com
Everything is shown there,except for the Superchip,Thanks Mike T!!
FENDER GUITARS ROCK!!!
Now,if it only looked like this in real life
#18
06-30-2001, 08:30 PM
#19
06-30-2001, 10:39 PM
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Ron Kaltenbach:
Duramax is still an unproven motor. Someone on the diesel board looked into ordering one recently. GM has stopped taking orders for them. Seems there may be a #5 injector problem - several have blown up.
Also, as usual, GM has overrated the horsepower they actually put out. Powerstroke also puts out 505 ft lbs of torque. Don't believe all those great stories about the Duramax you here. The Powerstroke is a proven durable performer. I would not even consider a first year diesel motor - especially from GM.
</font>
Duramax is still an unproven motor. Someone on the diesel board looked into ordering one recently. GM has stopped taking orders for them. Seems there may be a #5 injector problem - several have blown up.
Also, as usual, GM has overrated the horsepower they actually put out. Powerstroke also puts out 505 ft lbs of torque. Don't believe all those great stories about the Duramax you here. The Powerstroke is a proven durable performer. I would not even consider a first year diesel motor - especially from GM.
</font>
I see alot PSD owners that are scared to death that the DMAX is a better engine...Why? If GM raised the Bar it will only make the G2PSD better...THERE ARE ALOT OF FALSE RUMORS ON MELTING HEADS,etc...Dmax-mans is one of the techs that looks at the replaced engines and has yet to see any head problems...
#20
06-30-2001, 10:44 PM
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Superchips_Distributor:
Hi Dogcam,
Yes, we've been hearing of problems with the Allison 5-speed automatic already too. That's a shame, as that is supposed to be one of it's strong points.
Having had a chance to drive both, I don't think the Duramax compares favorably to the PSD bone-stock, it seems sluggish compared to the PSD, though it's certainly an improvement over their last GM diesel, which was an absolute POS. Back when Superchips was doing the developement work for the early PSD's (95), they were also developing an application for the GM diesel, but could never release it as the GM diesel was so prone to fail, very weak crank, snouts shearing of the crank, etc.
I would never consider buying any first- or even second-year diesel from GM, given their track record. I'd want to see some serious *positive* track record established before considering that powerplant, but tha't sjust me, and others may very well feel differently, especially those who tend to buy GM. Time will tell, and I hope for GM's sake (moreso for their customers sake) that the Duramax turns out to be a much better motor than their previous diesels.
</font>
Hi Dogcam,
Yes, we've been hearing of problems with the Allison 5-speed automatic already too. That's a shame, as that is supposed to be one of it's strong points.
Having had a chance to drive both, I don't think the Duramax compares favorably to the PSD bone-stock, it seems sluggish compared to the PSD, though it's certainly an improvement over their last GM diesel, which was an absolute POS. Back when Superchips was doing the developement work for the early PSD's (95), they were also developing an application for the GM diesel, but could never release it as the GM diesel was so prone to fail, very weak crank, snouts shearing of the crank, etc.
I would never consider buying any first- or even second-year diesel from GM, given their track record. I'd want to see some serious *positive* track record established before considering that powerplant, but tha't sjust me, and others may very well feel differently, especially those who tend to buy GM. Time will tell, and I hope for GM's sake (moreso for their customers sake) that the Duramax turns out to be a much better motor than their previous diesels.
</font>
Actually, feel and real world results aren't the same..it has been posted numerous times that the DMAX will blow a stock PSD out as well as the cummins...now add a chip to either of those engines and its a different story...
90% of the allison problems has been bad programming..some minor failiures but that is to be expected on a first year product..at any rate, i would take an ALLISON over a 4r100 any day of the week...PSD fans better hope that ford can develop the 5r100 better...
#21
06-30-2001, 10:50 PM
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Superchips_Distributor:
Hi 4X4,
Thanks for your post.
However, you're looking a numbers on paper, and in the real world, it doesn't perform up to those numbers, in my humble opinion. The PSD and the Duramax share the same 505 peak torque rating, but the PSD feels noticeably stronger, I think. We may have a case of a bit of an inflated rating, it wouldn't be the first time an automaker did that, over the years just about all of them have from time to time.
It's also an unproven engine (as Ron mentioned) from a manufacturer with a *terrible* track record in consumer diesel engines, so it's going to take a few years before we see if this new Duramax is really up to the job. There's no doubt that it's a better effort than their past motor, you bet! But it's going to take a few years for it to prove itself to be in the same category with the well-proven Powerstroke diesel. As I said in another post, I hope for GM's and their customer's sake that it turns out to be a great motor!
</font>
Hi 4X4,
Thanks for your post.
However, you're looking a numbers on paper, and in the real world, it doesn't perform up to those numbers, in my humble opinion. The PSD and the Duramax share the same 505 peak torque rating, but the PSD feels noticeably stronger, I think. We may have a case of a bit of an inflated rating, it wouldn't be the first time an automaker did that, over the years just about all of them have from time to time.
It's also an unproven engine (as Ron mentioned) from a manufacturer with a *terrible* track record in consumer diesel engines, so it's going to take a few years before we see if this new Duramax is really up to the job. There's no doubt that it's a better effort than their past motor, you bet!
But it's going to take a few years for it to prove itself to be in the same category with the well-proven Powerstroke diesel. As I said in another post, I hope for GM's and their customer's sake that it turns out to be a great motor!</font>
Valid point on the proven PSD, but are you gonna say the same thing about the G2 6.0 PSD next year as you are saying now about the DMAX? i doubt it, 90% or ford guys talk about proven this and that, i wouldn't drive a first year product/diesel, but they will also be the first in line for the 6.0...
However, i am not looking at numbers on paper..I have the 8.1l in my HD, but i have driven a few duramax's, and to say the least they are not overinflated numbers...one of the dmax guys dynoned his HD at like 255 HP at the rear wheels which was very impressive considering the amount of HP loss you have through the allison...anyway you slice it, the Duramx made by ISUZU is on top right now..i suspect that will change with the G2 PSD and the new cummins as it should...i wouldn't worry about GM too much on this one, ISUZU did all the leg work and considering they are a world class diesel maker, i wouldn't be worried...
------------------
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#22
07-01-2001, 07:07 PM
Former Sponsor
Hi 4X4,
Look, this isn't an argument, or at least, I'm not going to argue here about this with you. If you're happy enough with it to buy it, then that is all that matters, what you think, as it's your vehicle, obviously. That's great, I'm happy for you, and I hope it turns out to the best vehicle you've ever had!
That still doesn't change my mind, nor my thoughts & impressions about this vehicle. Nor is this really the place to get defensive about and/or argue for GM products, this is a *Ford*-oriented web site.
I'd take an International-built diesel long before I'd take an Isuzu diesel. For what it's worth, I don't think much of Ford's previous diesel either, the Navistar. It was still better than GM's, but it's not in the same ballpark with the International-built PSD. Navistar has since purchased International of course, but it's still an International-built motor that is infinately preferable to me over an Isuzu.
I'm glad you're happy with your decision, and you don't need to defend it to me or to anyone else here, you are the only one that needs to be happy with your decision, and I truly hope that you will be.
Good luck!
Look, this isn't an argument, or at least, I'm not going to argue here about this with you. If you're happy enough with it to buy it, then that is all that matters, what you think, as it's your vehicle, obviously. That's great, I'm happy for you, and I hope it turns out to the best vehicle you've ever had!
That still doesn't change my mind, nor my thoughts & impressions about this vehicle. Nor is this really the place to get defensive about and/or argue for GM products, this is a *Ford*-oriented web site.
I'd take an International-built diesel long before I'd take an Isuzu diesel. For what it's worth, I don't think much of Ford's previous diesel either, the Navistar. It was still better than GM's, but it's not in the same ballpark with the International-built PSD. Navistar has since purchased International of course, but it's still an International-built motor that is infinately preferable to me over an Isuzu.
I'm glad you're happy with your decision, and you don't need to defend it to me or to anyone else here, you are the only one that needs to be happy with your decision, and I truly hope that you will be.
Good luck!
#23
07-02-2001, 08:20 AM
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article
http://www.62-65-dieselpage.com/features/dieselday.htm
I agree this isn't the place to argue it, but its also not right just to bash it because its "the other guys"...i had a super duty and have nothing but good things to say about it...the PSD is a great engine, just not the best anymore...but again i suspect that will change in 03...
read the article, the results are interesting...
I agree this isn't the place to argue it, but its also not right just to bash it because its "the other guys"...i had a super duty and have nothing but good things to say about it...the PSD is a great engine, just not the best anymore...but again i suspect that will change in 03...
read the article, the results are interesting...
#25
07-02-2001, 01:32 PM
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i've driven quite a few power strokes and some have felt stonger than others, the dodge 24v diesel felt pretty even to the power stroke, but the new duramax (only 10,000k may not have been broken in yet) felt like 150 of the 300 hp were hidding, no bottom end at all and even when the boost did come on it was not to exciting, out of them all i felt the dodge had the most low end grunt but the ford would catch that at a little higher rpm and above that would keep pulling hard. Personaly opinion is that i felt the gm was sick, i believe it should have pulled better than that, it was so slak that i felt an non turbo idi ford diesel would give it a run for its money, one nice point you could sure feel the engine braking of the allison auto, it was the only duramax i've driven so maybe it was just sick, but if not then thats pretty sad
#26
07-02-2001, 02:07 PM
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did you read the article??
Feeling one way and performing are two different things..I really don't care how it feels as long as it does what it suppose to do..
I would say you drove a bad one...I have driven a 24v cummins and it is an absolute slug in stock form..add a chip and that thing is a monster..same goes for the PSD..my best comparison for the DMAX is that it feels and acts like a mildy chipped PSD...
I would say you drove a bad one...I have driven a 24v cummins and it is an absolute slug in stock form..add a chip and that thing is a monster..same goes for the PSD..my best comparison for the DMAX is that it feels and acts like a mildy chipped PSD...
#27
07-02-2001, 02:32 PM
Former Sponsor
Hi 4X4,
I couldn't agree more on that, you bet! I don't think for a minute that just because it's a GM product, it somehow automatically becomes not desireable, I just commented on this perhaps not being the place to argue the merits of GM products since it's a FoMoCo-oriented site, that's all, but that's just my opinion.
In fact, I have to confess than even with family at Ford since just after WW1, I myself didn't buy many FoMoCo products until about 1992. So I have owned a number of GM vehicles, most of which I was pretty happy with! For much my childhood, I dreamed of the day I would be able to walk into a Chevy store and buy a new Corvette, perhaps like many young boys, I drooled at the mere thought of owing a Corvette, and eventually did.
In the early 90's, we started to take advantage of the A-plan pricing for Fords, thanks to family at Ford, and so every since then, aside from a few Corvettes, almost everything we've purchased sicne has been a FoMoCo product.
Bottom line, there have been plenty of GM vehicles (and others) that have made their home with us, and the vast majority of them were enjoyed quite a bit, with very few major problems, etc.
I really do hope your new GM will be a great vehicle that will bring you many years of enjoyment, & thanks for sharing your thoughts!
I couldn't agree more on that, you bet! I don't think for a minute that just because it's a GM product, it somehow automatically becomes not desireable, I just commented on this perhaps not being the place to argue the merits of GM products since it's a FoMoCo-oriented site, that's all, but that's just my opinion.
In fact, I have to confess than even with family at Ford since just after WW1, I myself didn't buy many FoMoCo products until about 1992. So I have owned a number of GM vehicles, most of which I was pretty happy with! For much my childhood, I dreamed of the day I would be able to walk into a Chevy store and buy a new Corvette, perhaps like many young boys, I drooled at the mere thought of owing a Corvette, and eventually did.
In the early 90's, we started to take advantage of the A-plan pricing for Fords, thanks to family at Ford, and so every since then, aside from a few Corvettes, almost everything we've purchased sicne has been a FoMoCo product.
Bottom line, there have been plenty of GM vehicles (and others) that have made their home with us, and the vast majority of them were enjoyed quite a bit, with very few major problems, etc.
I really do hope your new GM will be a great vehicle that will bring you many years of enjoyment, & thanks for sharing your thoughts!
Last edited by Superchips_Distributor; 07-02-2001 at 02:35 PM.
#28
07-07-2001, 12:51 AM
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Ahhh!!!
#29
07-07-2001, 01:12 PM
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I filled out a survey on the Chevy website about a month or two ago, and just this week, Chevy sent me a brochure with prices and options on the Avalanche and a little Maisto 1/64th scale version. it's like the Explorer copper/red color kind of. Kind of a cool little gimmick. I may even opt for one when my lease is up in Sept '03....that is of course unless Ford retaliates with something better...HINT HINT FORD!!!!!
