"stacking" chips with programmer
#1
10-19-2004, 04:44 PM
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"stacking" chips with programmer
I'm am asking this queston mainly out of curiosity. Can the max tuner loads into the computer be "stacked" on top of a chip's program for even higher horsepower gains? I see where you can do this with the Bank's programmer system and was wondering if you could do it with others.
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10-19-2004, 09:35 PM
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#4
10-21-2004, 02:34 PM
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This is something that has been discussed many times, so all that info is available by simply using the SEARCH feature. 
Phil (openclasspro) is exactly right, you cannot do that in gasoline engines - that is something that can be done only in certain diesels, and even then it's only applicable when the tuning doesn't or can't properly address everything affecting power (like the pedal map, just for one example) - diesel controls are quite different from gasoline motors.
With gas engines using either EEC-IV or EEC-V PCM's, you can use *either* a chip *or* a tuner - never both. And on the new body style F-150's (2004 & up) using the Power PC-based PCM's, you can't use a traditional chip at all, as there's no place to put it - you have to use a tuner to flash the PCM due to their design.
What would happen if you used a tuner to flash the PCM with performance tuning, and then installed a chip too, would be the PCM would ignore whatever program you flashed into it via the tuner, and run off the instructions stored in the chip. (The J3 connector on EEC-IV & EEC-V PCM's basically acts like an override circuit.) Now if you installed a chip first, and *then* tried to use a tuner, usually the tuner can't even communicate with the PCM as the J3 circuit would be engaged due to the chip being present, so you couldn't flash the PCM at all with a chip present.
Remember, tuning isn't a never-ending well of power that you can just keep dipping into for more - once the motor has a good sharp tune, that's it - then you have to actually do some mechanical modifications (bolt-on mods, etc.) to get more power from the motor.
Phil (openclasspro) is exactly right, you cannot do that in gasoline engines - that is something that can be done only in certain diesels, and even then it's only applicable when the tuning doesn't or can't properly address everything affecting power (like the pedal map, just for one example) - diesel controls are quite different from gasoline motors.
With gas engines using either EEC-IV or EEC-V PCM's, you can use *either* a chip *or* a tuner - never both. And on the new body style F-150's (2004 & up) using the Power PC-based PCM's, you can't use a traditional chip at all, as there's no place to put it - you have to use a tuner to flash the PCM due to their design.
What would happen if you used a tuner to flash the PCM with performance tuning, and then installed a chip too, would be the PCM would ignore whatever program you flashed into it via the tuner, and run off the instructions stored in the chip. (The J3 connector on EEC-IV & EEC-V PCM's basically acts like an override circuit.) Now if you installed a chip first, and *then* tried to use a tuner, usually the tuner can't even communicate with the PCM as the J3 circuit would be engaged due to the chip being present, so you couldn't flash the PCM at all with a chip present.
Remember, tuning isn't a never-ending well of power that you can just keep dipping into for more - once the motor has a good sharp tune, that's it - then you have to actually do some mechanical modifications (bolt-on mods, etc.) to get more power from the motor.