Let me first say I have no doubt, based on what others have said, that you are a world class tuner. And, a few years ago I bought a Superchips microtuner for my 2003 F150. I bought this tuner based on advise from you & it worked realy well and I was quite happy. I bought a 1745 for my 2005 F150, again based on your advise. I have recently read a few posts from you where you "put people in their place" for comments they made here. So, that being the case, please explain the following comments you recently made, and these are quotes from you: "Canned tune is a waste of money" and, in refering to a troyer tuned XCal2, "anything else is really a waste of time & money to anyone who cares". Well, even though I only bought a "canned" tuner (and it is really all I need) I do care about my truck. For you to imply that those of us who ONLY buy a "canned" tuner are wasting our money and don't really care, well in my opinion, is a very stupid comment on your part. Not all of us want to add different exhaust, different belts & fans, different intakes, etc. Many of us, and we are customers of yours, have put many hours of thought into what WE REALLY NEED, and that is not a custom tune. Since I am wasting my time & money and don't care (your words) I believe I will take my future business elsewhere. Have a nice day.

 

Bob;

I'm not here to defend anyone - nor is it required since the reputation you are trying to tarnish is above reproach. That overwhelming support was earned, not bought - keep that in mind.

But, I'd like to point out that perhaps you over-reacted, and quoted stuff out of context - which basically defeats the real intent of what was actually said. To wit:

If that was what you were referring to ... I myself, and I suspect most others, would interpret it differently. Please read it again.

And have you considered just picking up the phone and discussing with Mike, instead of flaming here ? I think that would have made all the difference, and would have been the right thing to do.


Grog

 

Some people's tighties are just that, TIGHT. And people are usually granted their opinion. Many truisms about opnions. Pick one.

 

I see it like this... Any I am on the fence with XCal and Edge and maybe even the 1745 now... Mike is saying that if you are going to go thru the trouble and money to invest in exhaust, intake, pulleys, turbo and whatever else, it makes NO sence to not be custom tunes. For us daily drivers, I dont see a need for a 400.00 tuner, myself. Bob, I know how confusing this forum can be, it took me a month to decide on a stinkin muffler fuh kryin out loud!! I sometimes wish I wouldnt read too far into stuff like this... The wealth of knowledge here can be overwelming at times.... Can't we all just get along??!?

EDIT: Also Bob, how is the 1745 working for your truck?? I may look into that one more...

 

BOBS SCREW,

As much as i hate to say this: You will have better luck putting your message in a bottle and throwing it in the ocean than voicing your opinion here against Troyer Perf.

If you ever do decide to send a message in a bottle, ill include mine too.

 

From what I have heard about hime, he really is one of the best. I agree with him that custom tuned really is the best way to go in most situations.

 

If you have a problem with us the proper way to handle it, as per the rules of F-150 Online, is to call us - not by taking snips of text from only a couple of posts and put them here out of context, which isn’t representative of the overall content we have posted on this topic over the past few months, and which is critical to anyone actually interested in trying to understand this.

Since you have chosen to try doing this here, I will briefly address some of this here, and then we need to go over this in a personal phone call.

First - I do not see how you could have actually read a "significant" number of my posts, as if you had you would know that over the past few months we have informed everyone here that we do not like the idea of canned tunes for the 2004 & newer trucks simply due to them having a tendency to run lean from the factory in bone stock trim – it’s a small number, but it’s enough to be a concern to those of us who actually have profound knowledge about this and care about the vehicle.

We have made literally hundreds of posts about the problem with some of the 2004 & newer 5.4 3V's running dead lean in showroom stock condition, and the fact that this was data we did not have (nor did anyone else, and frankly, I don't think anyone else has the amount of data we do on this) until a few months ago - it took us being able to dyno literally *hundreds* of 5.4 3V trucks in bone-stock trim to be able to identify an issue in a small number of them - rather than something that was just a 1 in a million kind of quirk. See, by the time most vehicles come to us for dynoing, they already have some type of modification, and thus cannot give us valid data for bone-stock trucks – so it took the better part of 18+ months to dyno hundreds of 5.4 3V trucks in bone-stock trim to identify with certainty that there is an issue with *some* of the 5.4 3V's running lean right from the factory - some run 14.2:1 @ WOT, and some run as lean as 15.0:1 in bone-stock trim - this is a completely random issue, and no way to predict which one will and which will not - it has nothing to do with PCM revision or anything else that is easily identifiable, it is completely random. And just as you had to have seen if you actually have read any significant number of my posts, we have harped on the need for datalogging for *years* here, for this and many other reasons.

For example, you may get 50 or more 5.4 3V's in a row that behave perfectly, hitting within a few tenths of their stock commanded A/F - and then out of the next 20, you may get 12 of them that will run lean, each of which will show a different A/F ratio despite the fact that all of them are commanding 12.0:1 stock. That is the reality, and what we have strived to inform people of as quickly as we accumulated that data. And nobody else has literally dynoed hundreds of bone-stock 5.4 3V F-150’s like we have. We do extraordinary things like that simply because we care deeply about these vehicles, and want to inform and protect F-150 owners.

You also conveniently ignore the fact that we have pointed out numerous times that we get significantly better results from our custom tuning over *any* canned tune, or the fact that we have pointed out numerous times that if you are going to go with a canned tune, then using the Superchips Inc product, like you have, is the way to go if you choose to go canned. This is why I think you either have not actually read a "significant" number of my posts, or you have chosen to ignore an awful lot of them, as your post certainly does not accurately reflect the overall content or tone of what we have posted here over just the past few months alone.

Now all of that being said - I do indeed understand your concern, and I share it! I think there are aspects that we need to discuss and we need to do that personally, off the boards here - and I am more than happy to do that.

So what I suggest is, if you wouldn't mind, please give us a call here and ask for me personally – please tell my staff your screen name here and that I have asked you to contact me personally so that they will put you thru to me, as I would like to speak with you at length about this - I really do not want you to have any misunderstanding about this - regardless of whether you choose to do business with us in the future or not, I want us to have a candid personal conversation about this.

Our number is listed below - I will tell our staff to expect your call so they can put you thru to me, OK? Thanks for your post, and I think once we can talk you will quickly have a better understanding about all of this. So please call us at our number listed below – and thanks in advance!

 

thats cool everybody can voice there own opinion , but the the big differance is do you want or need?? if you just want a tuner buy what ever you want! just dont piont and shoot !man ! its not cool. i dont need an execal 2 but , i sure do want one ! hey mike just sitting here waiting to put a smile on my face . my excal2 will be here soon. ordered last week ,cant wait .

 

There ya go Assinatra

 

And of course, the personal attacks are tolerated if a Troyer fan does it. BOB'S SCREW, be careful what you post about Troyer on here because any criticism will not be tolerated.

 

Very well put, Mike. I commend such a professional response. I wouldn't have the patience to respond to such an asinine post in that manner. Hey BOBS SCREW, since you will be looking for future advice elsewhere, let me help you out by teaching you how to spell "advice" correctly-- it is spelled with a "C" not an "S". Well, now ya know. Carry on.

 

Bob, do yourself a favour and re-read Mike's post that you quoted. You have pretty much snipped it out of context. You subsequently have based your baseless interpretation on a complete distortion of reality.

"anything else is really a waste of time & money to anyone who cares" is a snippet from: "For what it's worth, you have my apologies for us getting started off on such a sour note - I really hate that. Maybe the next time you drop by some place you'll think twice before spouting off about someone's reputation & capabilities. And it is my sincere hope that perhaps you will also take the time to actually learn a little bit about what it takes to actually get world-class tuning - as anything else is really a waste of time & money to anyone who cares about getting the best results for their hard-earned money.".

Now, I am no expert at English but have been using it for 50+ years and the above quoted paragraph in no way, shape, form nor explicitivity implies, asserts, contrives or attempts to fertilize me into believing TROYER PERFORMANCE is my only source for world-class tuning. I think it conveys that a Troyer-style tuning process is the ticket to the promised land.

Perhaps reading things that ruffle your feathers more than once (objectively) would be beneficial.

Think Type-B! http://www.psych.uncc.edu/pagoolka/TypeA-B-intro.html

"That's all I have to say about that!" - f., f.g.

 

HI!... WOW! This is got to be one of the stupidest threads I have seen on here in a while!!!! Well after reading MIKE's post it looks like BOB got "PUT IN HIS PLACE" lol!

 

The ONLY personal attacks allowed are against me.

But what in the hell does that quote have anything to do with me?

 

I am a bit confused now.If troyer feels so strongly about the 04 and newer trucks needing the custom tune to avoid any lean condition then why does he continue to sale the superchip and edge.