OK guys, flame away as I know this has probably been covered...but gonna ask anyways

Exhaust system plans...

True dual system with 2 1/2" pipe, two Magnaflow cats, two (SISO) Magnaflow (of undetermined dimensions) mufflers, and X-pipe.

Questions...

-Go long tube headders or leave stock exhaust manifold for low/mid range torque?

-With this system, is the headder vs no headder question dependant on having a tuner? I don't have one and will not be getting one soon?

-IF I go longtubes, where do you mount the cats and the O2 sensors? I've read mount the aft (downstream/rear) O2 sensors as close as possible (within 1") of the cat, but how do the cats and upstream sensors mount in relation to the headders?

-I'm assuming if you leave stock manifolds, upstream sensors will stay in the stock location and the new cats get mounted as close as possible to the existing forward cats?

Thanks guys!! Yea, I know I'm not new, but I haven't done as much exhaust research as I should.

 

Lt headers with a tune will boost your low end torque and hp. It will also be much louder. Cats and o2 sensors will go in the same order as stock. Your cats will be at the end of your collectors, and most headers will have bungs for the primary sensors. The secondary sensors go directly behind the cats.

 

Thanks for the reply, but please note I said I would not have a tune; thus would the long tubes be detrimental to my plans or should I install this dual exhaust system with stock manifolds?

Should the lack of a tune/tuner be a basis for any part of my decision, and what part if so?

 

Without a tune, those headers will still be just as loud, but the torque/hp increase will not be as much.

 

^^ The frog man speaketh truth!

In about three weeks, I'll have a better understanding of headers without a CT versus headers with a CT.

Galaxy, I get the feeling that when it comes to usin' a tuner/programmer, you're plum again' it. Is that so, and if so, why so?

It ain't that much of an investment, and for the money, it's the most bang for your buck.

 

No dude, not against it at all. In fact, I'd love to have one. For no expainable reason what-so-ever, every time I come up with a project I want to do to the old gal, the tuner just seems to creep its way down my priority list.

I'm on the exhaust kick right now cause I think my cat's are headed out anyways; I get A LOT of crackling and carrying on when I park the truck these days.

With these questions I'm asking, I just wanted to ensure long tubes (or true duals for that matter) are not a bad move without a tune. If it's an even wash, that's fine, just don't want to end up in a negative situation.

Since we're already here, I might as well ask (but yes, I'll go do some searching....)

What headders? Pacesetter??

 

Without a tuner you will have a check engine light because of the cats (or lack of). But the truck will still run fine. You'll feel more torque everywhere, and more power at higher rpms. A tune will give you better results and get rid of that light. I ran around for years after the long tube header install without a tune on my Trans am, it ran great. Just had that pesky c.e.l.

The only experience I've had with pace setters were on the above mentioned Trans am. The welds were good, fit good, had the jet hot aluminum coating; over all a decent piece for the price. I've heard they fit like **** on f150's, but I can't say yes or no.

 

In my quite recent experience, they fit just fine on my F150.

Galaxy, you may get a CEL with true duals AND long tubes. Shouldn't get a CEL with just true duals if you get hi-flow cats.

When I was looking for headers, my brands of choice were down to two: PaceSetter and OBX. After weeks and weeks of research, I heard very good and very bad about both. The very bad was almost always due to poor fitment in either case.

From where I sit, here are the positives for the OBX:
Stainless Steel construction (not the highest grade available, but stainless nonetheless)
Lower price
Lifetime guarantee *

Here are the negatives if found for the OBX:
Made in China
An almost complete lack of customer service! Every 'authorized dealer' I found (and even OBX themselves) were VERY hard to reach either by phone or email.
* Imagine trying to catch them if you have an actual problem with the merchandise!
It was unclear (and there was contradictory information available) concerning the fitment of 2WD AND 4WD for their 'headers only' kit (minus the y-pipe, cats, resonators, etc).

Here are the positives of the PaceSetter:
Made in the USA
Fitment guarantee
3 year warranty (not lifetime, but still good)
Available ceramic metallic coating
Competitive price
Available through numerous, helpful BBB accredited dealers!
Solid construction (welds, materials, etc)

Here are the negatives of the PaceSetter:
Not available in stainless
No lifetime guarantee
A few folks said they had fitment issues, but I had no problem at all.

When I wrote the pros and cons down and saw what it looked like on paper while deciding on which set to go with, it wasn't a hard decision for me to make.

Of course, good customer service AND domestically made merchandise are HUGE factors for me when buying pert' near anything.

If I were you, I'd get the programmer first, and then build off of that.

 

Edit: I just noticed that you're running basically the same exhaust I started out with.

Since that's the case, I'd definitely recommend going the same road I traveled.

Programmer/tuner first. (Gryphon or SCT X3)
Swap the exhaust from the cats back. (True duals or si/do with a Magnaflow, Dynomax, or Borla either way you go)
LT headers of your choice (Really diggin' the PaceSetters so far!)
Custom tunes for your mods.

In that order.

 

Me personally, would not run LT headers without a tune. If I spent the money and the time on it, then I am going to get the MAX performance out of it.

 

^ ^ Right. Can you run LT's without a tune? Yep. But you'll maximize your gains by getting a tune written for it.

 

of course you're gonna get the best out of anything by stacking a tune with it. Hell, just look at all the guys that are bone stock + a tune and are seeing the benefits. But keeping that in mind, you will still see plenty of gain with just doing LTs alone. Helping free up exhaust flow out of those crappy manifolds will help with or without a tune.

 

Thanks for all the info guys; awesome replies. Just want to clear up one thing...you guy mentioned a CEL a couple times with long tubes and no cats...I'm not doing that. Wether it's long tubes or not, I'll have the high flow cats.

Still expect a CEL??

 

^ You shouldn't have problem as long as you have cats at the end of the collectors, and the secondary sensors are at the end of the cats.

 

Two questions about Pacesetters…

-Do the headers have the bung already installed on them for the front/forward O2 sensors?
-Found two part numbers for my truck; 70-2226 & 70-2227. Can't tell a difference from the description at Summit…which one?