The military pays around $70,000 or more for each HUMMER. Wouldn't specially built PSD SuperDuty's, available in a wide variety of configurations for a lot less money (probably $35,000 when bought in huge numbers) get the job done? I don't understand why they need a specially built vehicle. I read a report on the civilian version of the HUMMER ($112,000) and it was not as great as you would expect.

 

Hopefully a military person will repsond to this, but I do know that those $70k HumVees are armored and I believe will go places a Ford truck could not due to ground clearance and that fact that the running gear is all hidden in the bottom of the vehicle. I suppose you could armor a truck, but not sure it can accomplish all the different configurations that HumVee design can provide. Just my very uneducated thoughts on it.

 

All military HUMVEES are not armored. The military HUMVEES have a shorter wheel base allowing them to be able to fit in tight places better. The wide body of the H1 allows an M-60 machine gunner to sit in the turret and not beat the snot out of everyone in the truck. Essentially the HUMVEE was designed to replace the Jeep. The military has four wheel drive pick ups but the HUMVEE is quicker, nimbler and easier to handle in the trees. If you open a military HUMVEE's hood the radiator is not vertical it is almost horizontal. This makes it a harder target to shoot. The center hump of the HUMVEE is high enough to be used for an arm rest and I do believe the underbody plumbing is in the hump.

Imagine being given an H1 told to patrol a certain area with very limited supervision. I think just about everyone reading this got a smile and the same thought "what can this baby do." The HUMVEE was purpose built to take the abuse and keep running.

I was talking with some of the vehicle guys the last time I was deployed and they were saying the only way they could tell if the thing was jumped was after repeated areial trips the clips holding the radiator down would develop a little play.

I'm sure there are many more reasons for the HUMVEE, but my usage of them while in the military was limited and these reasons are just what I have found.

I think the main reason they don't modify an existing truck is that it will pretty much be a new model by the time is finished.

 

Superduties are very capable trucks but they are no way comparable to what the HumVee was designed for. It is as mentioned to replace the Jeep. The HumVee is one bada$$ offroad machine for carrying troops. Very wide for extra stability, outrageous groud clearance. I remember when we got them overseas in the late 80's a lot of guys lost stripes because they couldn't resist the urge to see what it could and couldn't do offroad.
You want to tow and load the Superduty is the machine. You want to get four heavily armed soldiers anywhere in any terrain the HumVee is it.

 

If a SuperDuty was designed correctly, it could do everything a Hummer can do. All you would have to do is get the axles high enough. Basic design, the SuperDuty could stack up nicely against the Hummer. Maybe not the stock SuperDuties that we have now, but the original post asked about a specially built SuperDuty. With enough ground clearance, a sealed engine compartment with a snorkel, the right gear ratios and the right tranny, there would be no stopping a SuperDuty.

 

Now put a turret in the top and a fast way for the machine gunner to escape when under fire. That's one of the reasons the back of the Humvee is sloped.

I have no doubt Ford could do a redesign. By the time they were finished it would be so far from the original that it would not classify as a Superduty and would have been easier to develop a whole new truck. It would probably be a lot more reliable than the GM built Humvee.

Obviously the motoring public did not like the H1. If they did there would be more of them on the road, instead of the H2. the only thing the H2 and a military Humvee have in common is the bulider and they look similar.

The biggest complaint I heard was that the H1 was too hard to handle in the city. It is a good off road design but not easily road driven. Saying the H1 and the military Humvee are the same truck is like saying a the race cars at your local track and the car driven on the streets are the same.

The point is, Ford could easily design an off road truck with the same or better capabilities as the Humvee, but it would be easier to start with a completely blank sheet, take what you know from being the largest truck builder and design the vehicle. I have serious doubts that Ford would be able to sell them any cheaper than the Humvees. And the biggest reason is the military isn't looking for a replacement for the Humvee, so Ford would be spending a lot of money for nothing.

 

The History Channel just had a show "Tactical to Practical" that talked about just such a comparison. There is a new "Smart Truck" being built, based on the F-350 Super Duty. It's got LOTS of stuff on it, including night vision, grenade launcher, bulletproofing, oil slick dispenser, etc. It's quite the rig.

 

WWBF150, where you been, we haven't heard from you for a couple weeks...

I would think that in there somewhere you would want a fast get-a-way vehicle..and mileage is a huge plus!!!

 

I doubt seriously that a Super-Duty could compete with a Hummer-not for long anyway. We took delivery of our first HMMVW's in May 1988 when I was in Germany. Prior to that we had CUCV's (Essentially Chevy Silverado's with a beefier suspension- and we had Blazer's for the LT's, PLT SGT's and higher...

I drove Hummers, CUCV's and Deuce & a half's for the next 8 years and I've got to tell you- I never scraped a bumper on a wall or tree in all that time in a hummer. I have even parrallel parked my Hummers. From the tight cobblestone streets of Germany, to some of the most dense woods in Germany, Texas and Arizona, the blazing heat of Saudi Arabia & Iraq, to the blazing heat, merciless rain, and unrelenting cold of the choatically overcrowded streets of South Korea the Hummer has held up well.

They are very wide and surprisingly tall vehicles- but once you get used to them, they're a breeze to drive. (Tall meaning, they're taller than you'd expect them to be from seeing pictures- or from seeing one on the street. From the driver's seat, you're pretty high.)

$70,000 each? Must be for the new "Heavy Hummer" because our M998's were about $30,000 each. Why? I don't know. 70K is the starting price for a Civilian H1.

The military version is the epitome of a lunch bucket. All it had was a steering wheel, an insulating mat to keep the engine from running you out of it, holes in the floor to aid in clean up, four 2" thick pads over spring seats, a floor shifter and a steering wheel- that's it. Plastic roof & doors and the weakest heater you've ever seen. As long as you were sitting still, you had heat- the minute you got above 20 MPH, the heat ran right out of the numerous cracks. The MP's and some Infantry folks got the "armored" hummers that had hard tops, doors, provisions for an M-60 turrent or grenade launcher, etc...

I've done things in a hummer you'd be proud to have witnessed. I've forded 30+ inches of water, without benefit of a water-fording kit, I flooded (passenger compartment) the hell out of the truck, but she never quit or got stuck. I've been in soup out in the east Fort Hood that came up to the headlights at times, and never got stuck. I've been places on Fort Hood that only insects had seen prior to my arrival. I've done flat-out runs across the sands in the desert of Ft. Irwin, CA- Pedal to the metal blasts down Autobahn 3 & 5 in Germany and slow creeps up MSR 3 as well as mountains in Korea. Without exaggeration- I've gone up hills so steep I couldn't see the ground without opening a door & looking down. Looking out over the hood- I could only see slingpoints and blue sky. Quite scary when you don't know what's on the other side of that crest.... (Good thing we had great maps!)

For a 6.2L GM diesel, which back them only put out 150 HP (Torque rating unknown) that baby can work- and it can move. I would go into details about problems we had, but that may be classified. Everything I've told you so far you can learn on line.

I've driven the 2-door, 4-door and shelter-carrier M1035's... I was in telecommunications, and I can tell you- with all the stuff the hummer had to carry- let alone tow simultaneously, no "normal" civilian duty truck would last very long.

Everything on the hummer is heavy duty. Nothing wimpy at all. Of course, even today's hummers are based on 70's & 80's research. Their civilian counterparts have evolved in many ways- but when it comes down to "HEAVY DUTY" performance from a light-duty truck, there's only one choice. HUMMER...

(I saw the F350 prototype- it may be good too, if built to military specs... I can gurantee you this, as much as I love the HUmmer, when the temp got into the teens & colder- I would have traded spots instantly with my friends who were driving the Chevy built CUCV's.... They had good heaters, solid doors, and tight seals!!!)

 

Mach1, I've been busy with a few other things lately. Speaking of quick getaways, the "Smart Truck" could really haul a**, according to the show. I didn't see/hear anything about the engine though. Apparently, there are a few prototypes that have been built for testing already. The one thing that I really liked, was the retractable 50 cal. machine gun. It's just the thing for those slowpokes that like to drive in the passing lanes.

 

https://www.f150online.com/fordnews/view.cfm?nnum=45

 

Bighersh,

It was interesting reading your story. Thanks for sharing.

 

Great Insite...

WWBF150..glad to see you made it back, or are still around...

It would take some work to develop a SD to a military version...

 

There was a program on The Discovery Channel (?) that showed just such a military conversion of the SD. It was an F-350 CC with a PSD, BIGGER tires, cut out fenders, a camo paint job, plus other things. There was also a GM counterpart to the program. The GM was based on the 2500 series CC pickup also. It was also diesel powered. IIRC, the testers said that the Ford had more power. There were extensive drivetrain mods on both vehicles, as well as interior mods. There was no real winner in the test. It was just an "informational" show to let people see what the military was up to as far as vehicles.

 

The souped up version of hte F-350/C-3500 most likely would replace an older pick-up. Maybe even some of the HumVees roles but the design characteristics of the HumVee in an Infantry type environment ensures it will be around for a while.