For those of you who still care about freedom in this country

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  #136  
Old 01-08-2004, 11:23 AM
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1. Should we abolish unions?
Yes to all federals and state unions, No to private unions, that is an individual choice for a person to make on their own in the private sector.
What are federal and state unions, and how are they different than a private union? Should the UAW be outlawed? What about the AFL-CIO?

3. Is a balanced budget important?
Otherwise then yes a balanced budget is important and one that neither party has been able to do. The republicans were able to balance the budget on Clinton’s watch and control the democrats from run-a-way spending but now they have failed and the democrats being the big spenders they are anyway are having fun at the party…
You really do see the world through rose colored glasses don't you?

Facts:
Federal spending increased over 20% per annum under the first Bush Administration and increased by over 20% under the second Bush administration.

The budget increased by 4% under Clinton.

There was a Republican Congress under Clinton and there is a Republican Congress under Bush.

-Don
 

Last edited by sirket; 01-08-2004 at 11:42 AM.
  #137  
Old 01-08-2004, 11:40 AM
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You really make no sense at all with the argument of ”my tax dollars should not fund a school to preach for an hour a day” Sorry but that holds no water at all. Public schools do much more preaching then most religious schools do. They preach about how its ok to be gay, to have two mommies or two daddies, that is ok to have sex if you use protection and the list goes on.
There is nothing in the Constitution that prohibits schools from teaching about sex, but the First ammendment is pretty clear about religion.

Just to be clear, it isn't ok to be gay or to have sex with protection? I'm just trying to take notes here.

Since I have no voice what is preached about in a public school you should neither have a voice about what someone’s child is taught so long as that child’s parent is ok with it.
First, you do have a voice.

Second, I don't care what school parents send their kids to, so long as my tax dollars aren't paying for it.

Here is the thing you need to understand, you do NOT get a choice of where your money is spent once it has been taken away from you in the forum of taxes. It would be best if you learned that and understand it.
I do get a say and so does everyone else.

You have not yet offered a solution to the poor job public schools are doing.
You really are deluded

Explain this to me: 70% of New York states' tax revenue comes from New York City, but the city only sees 40% of the state education budget.

Guess who sees to this? The Republican state senate of NY. Please don't sit there and bitch about the plight of inner city kids while blaming the Democrats when it is the Republicans doing the screwing.

Should parents be involved in their child’s school? Absolutely, but not all parents have that kind of time (thanks liberals for all the high taxes that keep mommy and daddy both working to stay up with things)
In most cities, real estate values have outstripped wage increases. That's why "mommy and daddy" both have to work.

Perhaps you should go back to mommy and daddy and ask them to send you to school.

Schools are accountable for the education the children receive, not the parents. You offer a typical liberal excuse ”Not my fault, it’s the other guy”.
Funny you just proved my point... "It's not my fault my kid doesn't learn anything! It's the schools fault! So what if I don't help my kid with their homework? So what if I don't help them with their lessons?"

President Bush’s tax cuts are the MAIN reason the economy is bouncing back as it is, and doing much better then most people even thought possible
First, this was originally seen as a market correction and one that would be over quickly. 3 years later and things still haven't turned around.

Second, things still haven't turned around. The market is up slightly, but there has been no significant change in jobless numbers or in capital spending by companies.

I don't have a problem with tax cuts. I have a problem with tax cuts that result in increased debt that we have to pay back with interest. We are borrowing against the future. That only works if you expect the economic picture to brighten. Current budget projections continue to show $500+ Billion deficits for the next decade.

-Don
 
  #138  
Old 01-08-2004, 11:45 AM
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3. Is a balanced budget important?
Otherwise then yes a balanced budget is important and one that neither party has been able to do. The republicans were able to balance the budget on Clinton’s watch and control the democrats from run-a-way spending but now they have failed and the democrats being the big spenders they are anyway are having fun at the party…
So what you are saying is that in order to make this country work, we need a Democratic president and a Republican Congress.

Good idea. Let's do it!

-Don
 
  #139  
Old 01-08-2004, 11:51 AM
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Originally posted by sirket
So what you are saying is that in order to make this country work, we need a Democratic president and a Republican Congress....
...or we could just invade another third world country.
 
  #140  
Old 01-08-2004, 11:57 AM
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XLT,

You still haven't told us what you think about the Patriot Act 2. I pointed out that it does allow the FBI to investigate financial records of citizens without judicial oversight or even probable cause. What do you think of such a law?

-Don
 
  #141  
Old 01-08-2004, 12:01 PM
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'01: You may as well give up trying to reason with sirket. He is blinded by his hatred. Once someone is like that, you cannot reason with him/her.
 
  #142  
Old 01-08-2004, 12:01 PM
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Originally posted by Raoul
...or we could just invade another third world country.
It'll be years before we run out of countries to invade and when that happens, we can just start over! It's so simple!

The problem after WW2 was that we no longer had a war time economy to keep us vibrant. Clearly the solution is a constant war time economy. So what if we if have to start the wars! We're getting good at it

-Don
 
  #143  
Old 01-08-2004, 12:11 PM
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Originally posted by sirket
I am fully aware of the idea behind a flat tax plan. If we wanted to generate the same revenue we with a flat tax, then those making less than $150k a year would see their taxes increase, and those making more than $150k a year would see their taxes decrease. That sound good to you? Would you like to pay more in taxes?


You are pretty dense aren't you? Flat tax proposals aren't exactly complicated. What you fail to understand is that a flat tax system would see your taxes raised if we wanted to meet the same revenue targets.

-Don
Thank you very much for clearing up a commonly misunderstood theory among liberals and their view of taxes.

Liberals always run around screaming the rich do not pay taxes or pay very little, I believe you have even stated that but I may be wrong. Anyhow, they run around like wild little beavers screaming the rich do not pay taxes or much less then the middle class and the poor (who pay no taxes anyway).

I am glad you have finally put that myth to rest and accepted the fact that the rich pay MORE in taxes and the poor pay basically NOTHING in taxes…

Pretty good for a guy that is dense huh?
 
  #144  
Old 01-08-2004, 12:16 PM
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Originally posted by sirket
Second, things still haven't turned around. The market is up slightly, but there has been no significant change in jobless numbers or in capital spending by companies.

I don't have a problem with tax cuts. I have a problem with tax cuts that result in increased debt that we have to pay back with interest. We are borrowing against the future. That only works if you expect the economic picture to brighten. Current budget projections continue to show $500+ Billion deficits for the next decade.

-Don
You call an increase in the markets value of 23% - 25% for 2003 "slightly"?

No wonder you can't grasp the understanding how tax cuts grow the economy, create jobs and provide for more federal revenue...
 
  #145  
Old 01-08-2004, 12:22 PM
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Originally posted by sirket
XLT,

You still haven't told us what you think about the Patriot Act 2. I pointed out that it does allow the FBI to investigate financial records of citizens without judicial oversight or even probable cause. What do you think of such a law?

-Don
If that “is” truly a part of the Patriot Act 2 then I would disagree with it as far as “American” citizens are concerned. No agency of any kind should be allowed to do any type of search (investigating ones financial records) without the approval and oversight of the judicial branch.

Now if it involves “non-American” citizens living in America or abroad then no problem since it is ONLY American citizens that are protected by the Bill of Rights.

Now having said that I do not know for a fact that what you state is “actually” in the Patriot Act 2. It could simply be another “false” scare tactic the left is using to cuddle and protect terrorist…
 
  #146  
Old 01-08-2004, 12:25 PM
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Originally posted by Frank S
'01: You may as well give up trying to reason with sirket. He is blinded by his hatred. Once someone is like that, you cannot reason with him/her.
I can be reasoned with by logic, not emotions.

I have asked simple questions that have gone unanswered. I have linked to articles detailing wild spending under Bush that even his party is scared of. I have linked to terrifying abuses of power under Bush involving our civil liberties.

None of this seems to sway your opinion of Bush. I can honestly say I tried however.

You are right about one thing in this thread though: Howard Dean won't win the election. It isn't because of his politics, but simply because people do not like him.

It's a shame too. Dean has revolutionized the election process in this country. Much of his donations come from personal donations via the Internet instead of donations by corporations and special interest groups.

Dean stole the Democratic party away from the Democrats. Why do you think the other candidates hate him so much? He isn't a Democrat any more than Lierberman or Clark are. The only real Democrats running for office are Gephardt and Kerry.

What I want to know is why the $%^ the Republican party doesn't nominate a man like John McCain for president? Is he too honest? Not right wing enough? Bi-partisan instead of divisive?

-Don
 
  #147  
Old 01-08-2004, 12:27 PM
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Originally posted by 01 XLT Sport
You call an increase in the markets value of 23% - 25% for 2003 "slightly"?

No wonder you can't grasp the understanding how tax cuts grow the economy, create jobs and provide for more federal revenue...
How much did the market increase under Clinton? Right, just thought I would remind you.

-Don
 
  #148  
Old 01-08-2004, 12:28 PM
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Originally posted by 01 XLT Sport
Thank you very much for clearing up a commonly misunderstood theory among liberals and their view of taxes.
I notice you still haven't answered my question:

Do you want to pay more in taxes in order to have a flat tax system?

-Don
 
  #149  
Old 01-08-2004, 12:34 PM
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Originally posted by sirket
What are federal and state unions, and how are they different than a private union? Should the UAW be outlawed? What about the AFL-CIO?


You really do see the world through rose colored glasses don't you?

Facts:
Federal spending increased over 20% per annum under the first Bush Administration and increased by over 20% under the second Bush administration.

The budget increased by 4% under Clinton.

There was a Republican Congress under Clinton and there is a Republican Congress under Bush.

-Don
No, I do not see the world through liberal tinted glasses of pinkish red. When I see the world the sky is blue.

Not sure on the exact percentage but using your 20% for your President Bush I would say ”Yep, so what?” and further go on to explain this little story to you.

On September 11, 2001 there were some really mean guys, the kind that have no *****, brains fried from being brain washed by evil men in a distant land. One day they broke off into groups to take airplane rides on a nice day (sky was blue for me, pinkish red for liberals).

Anyway, the really mean, no ***** chickenchits took over the big pretty planes and flew them into some buildings were there were very nice and innocent people who were minding there own business doing no harm to no one.

Many of these innocent people, men, women, children were killed that day because of the really mean men who flew the big pretty planes…

Now my friend I am sorry to say, but unlike all liberal fantasies there was no happy ending to this story, it cost thousands of innocent people their lives it also put the economy on hold this had a devastating impact on our economy and the cost were beyond belief and thus the main reason for the higher cost to government…

Just pray to God that President Bush was and is the President because if it had been Algore we would have had many more terrorist attacks. Algore is a good friend and best buddy of the Coward Dean and thus he would had stood by like a little wussbag and watch things happen “wishing upon a magical star” for it to go away…
 
  #150  
Old 01-08-2004, 12:34 PM
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Originally posted by 01 XLT Sport
If that “is” truly a part of the Patriot Act 2 then I would disagree with it as far as “American” citizens are concerned. No agency of any kind should be allowed to do any type of search (investigating ones financial records) without the approval and oversight of the judicial branch.
It is part of the Patriot Act 2 and was signed into law by Bush.

Now if it involves “non-American” citizens living in America or abroad then no problem since it is ONLY American citizens that are protected by the Bill of Rights.
I could care less about the rights of non Americans.

Now having said that I do not know for a fact that what you state is “actually” in the Patriot Act 2. It could simply be another “false” scare tactic the left is using to cuddle and protect terrorist…
I have better things to do in this world than make up laws.

Read the article that I linked to when I started this thread.

The laws that were passed:
1) Allow the FBI to request records from financial institutions without judicial oversight or even probable cause.
2) Redefine "financial institution" to include anyone who provides credit including car dealerships and other businesses.
3) Include provisions for gag orders to accompany financial requests so that you will not even know you are being investigated.

-Don
 


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