...nevermind

 

C'mon...

 

$71 an hour? Average? Where did you hear that? Health benefits? Oh the horrors! Maybe the cost of health care is part of the problem. Again, the company has a right to make it can, so do the workers.

Scott, please show me where I've looked down at anyone making a large amount of money. You keep bringing up this baseless accusation, and you can never prove it. Do you even listen to yourself? When a CEO is "let go" he walks away with more money than most people will make in a lifetime, and that's for failing, and you're wrong, the union will protect it's members, that's it's job, but you can fire a union member. So to answer your question, yes we can.

According to the conservatives here, the middle class seems to be the problem with almost everything.

You need to learn some history Scott. Before the labor movement, the average worker had jack and ****, and jack was no where to be found. Before the labor movement, you wouldn't even have this conversation, you'd have started working 6 12 hour days per week when you were nine or ten and you'd never have a chance to compete on your own merits. That by no means exonerates the bad things unions do, especially the UAW, but that is how things are, and how things were. The only reason you can get a job on your own now, and compete for a wage is because of the work labor activists have done in the past.

 

I have read it many times over the years...

"And more-nimble Japanese competitors, led by Toyota Motor Corp., have a record of keeping a lid on labor costs for their U.S. workers as well as their most senior executives."

"While that 40 percent hourly cost differential looms large, it is far smaller than the gap in senior executive pay for the Detroit Three and Japan's own Big Three.

A 2006 study by economists at the University of Indiana concluded that Japanese CEOs earn one-third of the pay of their U.S. counterparts. The economists used tax records to estimate the pay of the Japanese executives.

UAW President Ron Gettelfinger said last month as contract talks began, "Let the people coming forth who are so critical of what we make, start off by telling us what they make. And how does it also apply to management? Is there a differential?"

http://www.reuters.com/article/basic...070803?sp=true

 

This in no way changes what is happening TODAY. Live in the past if you want, fine by me. The unions had purpose, they did many great things. Times have changed, laws have changed and the union is no longer needed.

I never argued about the past purpose of the Unions, guess you just wanted to rant about something.

 

If the laws have changed and unions are not needed then why are there still unions?

 

If the unions are so great why have memberships steadily dropped over the past 20 years? It is just a matter of time till they are gone

 

This is an article from 2007 but...

MARKET FORCES AT WORK?

Unlike U.S.-listed companies, Japanese corporations do not disclose individual executive compensation.

But Toyota's 25 board members made 3 billion yen for the past fiscal year, an average of roughly $1 million each.

At Nissan Motor Co. (7201.T: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz), with a Western influence at the top and Renault's (RENA.PA: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz) Carlos Ghosn at the head, nine directors split 2.5 billion yen, an average of $2.35 million each, excluding $9.5 million in share appreciation rights.

Their counterparts in Detroit made far more.

At the top of the heap, Ford reported total compensation of $28.18 million for Chief Executive Alan Mulally, who was wooed from a senior position at Boeing Co. (BA.N: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz).

At GM, CEO Rick Wagoner had total compensation of $10.2 million, including stock option and stock awards. His base salary was $1.28 million.

Chrysler CEO Tom LaSorda made $5.39 million in salary, benefits, bonus payments and stock awards, according to a filing by former parent DaimlerChrysler AG DCXGn.DE.

 

You didn't answer my question.

 

So it is ok to pay the health benefits because they are in the contract, but not ok to pay the executives whats in theirs?

 

Yeah one thing not mentioned here, Toyota has the full advantage of NON UNION workers. It is not even comparable. Let the UAW in Toyota and see how long they last in the US..

 

Great link, does not change my thoughts about the union but that is a real eye opener.

At the same time though it would stand to reason board members and CEO's are not paid the same. Since Toyota does not want to show what the CEO's make it is tough to compare apples to apples here

 

Sorry guys, the blue collar worker is not the problem, it's the white collar engineers. Toyota and Honda have better fuel economy and are perceived as better products. If our engineers did their jobs, U.S. manufacturers would be leading the way with more fuel efficient cars and therefore less demand for imports. But, if the U.S. had the technology for something better than the competition they would sell it to the highest bidder for the quick buck today and regret it tomorrow. That, my friends has been the American way, has it not?

 

Guys like Obama that support them.

 

That makes zero sense.

Scott, care to answer? As of now your silence speaks volumes.