An Open Thank You to Jim and Charles
#46
11-11-2005 | 10:32 AM
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From: Selden NY
#47
11-11-2005 | 11:57 AM
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From: NY
Originally Posted by racetested
Rick,
This post would be a good read for you. A fellow American who swapped over from years of competitors kits use and even talks about the static test in mention that you have concerns about. I figure independent comments hold more water sometimes as they have nothing to gain or lose.
http://www.noswizard.com/bboard/viewtopic.php?t=1188
This post would be a good read for you. A fellow American who swapped over from years of competitors kits use and even talks about the static test in mention that you have concerns about. I figure independent comments hold more water sometimes as they have nothing to gain or lose.
http://www.noswizard.com/bboard/viewtopic.php?t=1188
I sick of hearing your BS.
go home
#48
11-11-2005 | 12:45 PM
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From: Stinkin Joisey
Originally Posted by Noswizard
Fast Gator,
It's my guess that you will be quicker on the NX kit because the failures you have experienced are due to incorrect fitting of my system (otherwise you would not have had problems with the pipe) and if you have one of Denny's plates then the system couldn't possibly make the best numbers because the plates didn't allow the nozzle to protrude far enough.
The only fair comparrison would be if my system was fitted correctly and then compared with the NX results.
If however the NX kit doesn't produce a quicker 1/8 mile it will show you how bad they are, because if they can't beat my system when mine has been fitted badly then think how much the difference would be when all things were equal.
My personal opinion is that you are taking a longer harder road to a worse result, when ALL you needed to do was change to braided supply pipe and if you have Dennys plate - change that. This solution is FAR quicker and simpler plus there will be no extra cost on parts.
Like I said in a previous post NX wanted to buy and sell my Pulsoids because they tested them and found they were vastly superior to the ones they sell, so it doesn't make sense to remove the best solenoids in the world and replace them with inferior items.
Also like I posted earlier we have a growing number of customers who have logged results that prove you get quicker times using less gas when using my system, so I strongly advise you to think again before giving up on it.
Best wishes
Regards
Trev Thw WIZARD of NOS
It's my guess that you will be quicker on the NX kit because the failures you have experienced are due to incorrect fitting of my system (otherwise you would not have had problems with the pipe) and if you have one of Denny's plates then the system couldn't possibly make the best numbers because the plates didn't allow the nozzle to protrude far enough.
The only fair comparrison would be if my system was fitted correctly and then compared with the NX results.
If however the NX kit doesn't produce a quicker 1/8 mile it will show you how bad they are, because if they can't beat my system when mine has been fitted badly then think how much the difference would be when all things were equal.
My personal opinion is that you are taking a longer harder road to a worse result, when ALL you needed to do was change to braided supply pipe and if you have Dennys plate - change that. This solution is FAR quicker and simpler plus there will be no extra cost on parts.
Like I said in a previous post NX wanted to buy and sell my Pulsoids because they tested them and found they were vastly superior to the ones they sell, so it doesn't make sense to remove the best solenoids in the world and replace them with inferior items.
Also like I posted earlier we have a growing number of customers who have logged results that prove you get quicker times using less gas when using my system, so I strongly advise you to think again before giving up on it.
Best wishes
Regards
Trev Thw WIZARD of NOS
Thank you for your advice. But you must understand my frustration of the problems that keep coming up. Especially when your kit was promoted as the BEST! The blowing of the nitrous suppy line at 1050psi was the last straw for me. The racing season is winding down where I live. I wanted to make a good number for the winter.
I know you keep saying that the kit was installed improperly. I was not using the nitrous plate, but rather drilled and tapped my upper plenum, and installed your nozzle there. After all this kit was for the Lightning and came with a tap.
You state in your opinion, which I respect, that if I replaced the plastic line with the braided line my problems would be over. I was told I would need a purge, at a price of $200 to run that braided line. I honestly could not see spending any more money on your kit at this point. And with your controller.......a very nice piece......Iam in pretty deep. And I have as yet, to see a highly modified Lightning get good results with your kit. So that is the reason I have decided to go with a proven system for a modified Lightning. And yes it was a hard decision, its not like Iam printing money
Here's a thought......... I know Denny says its not the kits fault, but rather the installation. But isn't it a possibility that I recieved a bad nitrous line? Maybe your supplier had a bad run? I mean it's not a perfect world.
#49
11-11-2005 | 12:48 PM
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From: Stinkin Joisey
Originally Posted by Rob_02Lightning
I call Gator's Race Tested Kit 
I already have 2 bottles, I'm thinking "2" feed lines "4" Solenoids and "2" nozzles has got to be twice the fun
What r u say Gator ? Freebie, Zilch, Notta, Nothing ......
DO WE HAVE A DEAL
I already have 2 bottles, I'm thinking "2" feed lines "4" Solenoids and "2" nozzles has got to be twice the fun
What r u say Gator ? Freebie, Zilch, Notta, Nothing ......
DO WE HAVE A DEAL
giving you my kit and having you run 2 kits would be like giving a 4 yr old a loaded gun!
The results would not be pretty
#50
11-11-2005 | 03:16 PM
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Gator,
What major problems are you so fed up with. Really think about what major problems are, especially when it comes to nitrous?
1) You had a leaking bottle valve from our optional pressure port. Not a design problem but a seal problem when I tapped the port. I gave you a new valve, no questions asked and you will never have that problem again.
2) Your nitrous liner burst which we have never denied can happen and our manual even states the line can burst. I even mentioned when you bought the kit as you had concerns that I can't guarantee the line will be full proof. What I can say is the line is better suited for nitrous use when it comes to flow efficiency. On the other hand braided has a higher pressure rating but it gives up performance and needs a purge. So look at it from our point of view when designing something for performance. Use a nylon line that works better in 95% of the applications or give up performance. We choose the nylon and if there are pressure issues, we gladly offer the braided as an upgarde or for FREEif the nylon does not work as this is a warranty issue. So to answer your question, it could have been a bad pipe and that's why I said I would send a new one but never heard back.
3) It doesn't matter what kit you use, you will need a purge for any braided line. You don't even have to buy our purge as it's a minimal part of the system and doesn't need our expensive solenoid. I even used to recommend other purge kits so customers could save money until they started leaking when the internal seals went bad.
I never blamed JDM or anyone else for doing a poor install. I said the kits are new to people and even tuners compared to what they are used to, so having install or tuning issues is not uncommon. We have years of experience as this is all we deal in, so install issues are not uncommon. This isn't a matter of saying we are always right, it's just averages of when it's been a product problem or an install problem. So this goes back to your bursted line and you can go to our board and do a search. Yes it has happened in the past and possible but the percentage is like next to nothing.
As far as power, I can't help you there as I am not a tuner. I do know many Lightnings have made record numbers but I am not one to bring their names into my debates. If they want to share then that is their choice. The part where a person expects 100hp from a 100hp jet no matter what can't be helped by me as there are to many variables? My company name is "Race Tested" and not "Dyno Queen". If your track results show what you expect and MORE then I don't think anyone can complain about dyno numbers.
You know I am always available for help, will replace any part that is defective for FREE, and beyond that I don't know what more I can do.
What major problems are you so fed up with. Really think about what major problems are, especially when it comes to nitrous?
1) You had a leaking bottle valve from our optional pressure port. Not a design problem but a seal problem when I tapped the port. I gave you a new valve, no questions asked and you will never have that problem again.
2) Your nitrous liner burst which we have never denied can happen and our manual even states the line can burst. I even mentioned when you bought the kit as you had concerns that I can't guarantee the line will be full proof. What I can say is the line is better suited for nitrous use when it comes to flow efficiency. On the other hand braided has a higher pressure rating but it gives up performance and needs a purge. So look at it from our point of view when designing something for performance. Use a nylon line that works better in 95% of the applications or give up performance. We choose the nylon and if there are pressure issues, we gladly offer the braided as an upgarde or for FREEif the nylon does not work as this is a warranty issue. So to answer your question, it could have been a bad pipe and that's why I said I would send a new one but never heard back.
3) It doesn't matter what kit you use, you will need a purge for any braided line. You don't even have to buy our purge as it's a minimal part of the system and doesn't need our expensive solenoid. I even used to recommend other purge kits so customers could save money until they started leaking when the internal seals went bad.
I never blamed JDM or anyone else for doing a poor install. I said the kits are new to people and even tuners compared to what they are used to, so having install or tuning issues is not uncommon. We have years of experience as this is all we deal in, so install issues are not uncommon. This isn't a matter of saying we are always right, it's just averages of when it's been a product problem or an install problem. So this goes back to your bursted line and you can go to our board and do a search. Yes it has happened in the past and possible but the percentage is like next to nothing.
As far as power, I can't help you there as I am not a tuner. I do know many Lightnings have made record numbers but I am not one to bring their names into my debates. If they want to share then that is their choice. The part where a person expects 100hp from a 100hp jet no matter what can't be helped by me as there are to many variables? My company name is "Race Tested" and not "Dyno Queen". If your track results show what you expect and MORE then I don't think anyone can complain about dyno numbers.
You know I am always available for help, will replace any part that is defective for FREE, and beyond that I don't know what more I can do.
#52
11-11-2005 | 04:40 PM
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From: NH
First I have to say I have the utmost respect for both Fast Gator and Rob, especially Fast Gator since he is the reason I ever bought a Lightning… 
I have read many of these threads with great interest, and in my opinion, if guys like me where making post about problems it might not add up to much.
However, I have read post from some very highly respected Lightning owners, Fast Gator, Rob and a few others as well as two of the top tuners in the business and find it quite easy to come to a simple conclusion:
For stock and lightly modified Lightning’s it appears the Racetested kit works great with great results. For more then lightly modified to heavy modified, such as Fast Gator and Rob, the Racetested kit has yet to pass the test. It appears there is very little to no research or development of the Racetested kit as it pertains to highly modified vehicles, or at least highly modified vehicles with superchargers.
While some may disagree with me there is not that much special about a Lightning motor. It’s a 5.4 with a blower on it. There are many motors in that cubic inch family with blowers, or have added blowers, and I can’t help but conclude that Racetested statements "it’s due to installation errors and/or because it’s a special motor" to be bogus and false.
Racetested appears to be a “great” kit for some applications but it is not a “great” kit for all installations.
Let’s face it, just like the 5.4 with a blower, there is nothing special about a Racetested kit other then their solenoids and controller. I say that because any nitrous kit is basically the same as far installation, is it not? Do you not find a location to mount the nozzle and then install feed lines for the nitrous and fuel? What is special about that? Sure the nozzle design may be different, length, etc but nothing different about actually installing it compared to any other brand of nitrous.
I suspect, based on my years of experience with statistic’s and probability, that there are many more then just a “few” people having problems with this kit. I also suspect the common response of “installation errors” to be bogus. That is based, once again, on my years experience with statistic’s and probability. Everyone can not be having issues because of installation.
The common denominator is the actual kit itself and that is where the problem lays. That is based on simple statistic’s and probability. That in large part comes based on a few post I have read from two of the Lightning communities top tuners who have experience installing and working with nitrous systems. These are not stupid people and I can’t see how you would ever find someone with more experience with installations.
I do not mean to come off as being rude but personally am getting a bit feed up seeing some of the “top dogs” and “tuners” getting blamed for something they may have or may have not done correctly rather then facing the facts, based off simple statistics and probability, and look into why the Racetested kit is not performing as it should in highly modified Lightning’s. You will not find the root cause of the problem until you first admit there is actually an issue with your nitrous kit and/or its parts.
There IS a problem, it HAS been proven so it IS time to do some analysis and determine what the root cause of the Racetested kit is when installed on highly modified Lightning’s.
As I said, from all my reading the Racetested kit appears to be an excellent kit for stock and lightly modified Lightning’s so maybe it’s time to step the kit up to the next level, the level which includes the highly modified Lightning’s…
I have read many of these threads with great interest, and in my opinion, if guys like me where making post about problems it might not add up to much.
However, I have read post from some very highly respected Lightning owners, Fast Gator, Rob and a few others as well as two of the top tuners in the business and find it quite easy to come to a simple conclusion:
For stock and lightly modified Lightning’s it appears the Racetested kit works great with great results. For more then lightly modified to heavy modified, such as Fast Gator and Rob, the Racetested kit has yet to pass the test. It appears there is very little to no research or development of the Racetested kit as it pertains to highly modified vehicles, or at least highly modified vehicles with superchargers.
While some may disagree with me there is not that much special about a Lightning motor. It’s a 5.4 with a blower on it. There are many motors in that cubic inch family with blowers, or have added blowers, and I can’t help but conclude that Racetested statements "it’s due to installation errors and/or because it’s a special motor" to be bogus and false.
Racetested appears to be a “great” kit for some applications but it is not a “great” kit for all installations.
Let’s face it, just like the 5.4 with a blower, there is nothing special about a Racetested kit other then their solenoids and controller. I say that because any nitrous kit is basically the same as far installation, is it not? Do you not find a location to mount the nozzle and then install feed lines for the nitrous and fuel? What is special about that? Sure the nozzle design may be different, length, etc but nothing different about actually installing it compared to any other brand of nitrous.
I suspect, based on my years of experience with statistic’s and probability, that there are many more then just a “few” people having problems with this kit. I also suspect the common response of “installation errors” to be bogus. That is based, once again, on my years experience with statistic’s and probability. Everyone can not be having issues because of installation.
The common denominator is the actual kit itself and that is where the problem lays. That is based on simple statistic’s and probability. That in large part comes based on a few post I have read from two of the Lightning communities top tuners who have experience installing and working with nitrous systems. These are not stupid people and I can’t see how you would ever find someone with more experience with installations.
I do not mean to come off as being rude but personally am getting a bit feed up seeing some of the “top dogs” and “tuners” getting blamed for something they may have or may have not done correctly rather then facing the facts, based off simple statistics and probability, and look into why the Racetested kit is not performing as it should in highly modified Lightning’s. You will not find the root cause of the problem until you first admit there is actually an issue with your nitrous kit and/or its parts.
There IS a problem, it HAS been proven so it IS time to do some analysis and determine what the root cause of the Racetested kit is when installed on highly modified Lightning’s.
As I said, from all my reading the Racetested kit appears to be an excellent kit for stock and lightly modified Lightning’s so maybe it’s time to step the kit up to the next level, the level which includes the highly modified Lightning’s…
#53
11-11-2005 | 06:33 PM
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From: Bridgeport, MI
Gator old buddy, I am truly sorry to see another thread go to this page after page of Racetested stuff! It started off you just wanted to say thank you to Charles & Jim.
Here is a thought Race tested, why don't you take the time to come out to a Rob02's or a Fast Gators truck that have your kit installed wrong. Show them how it's supposed to be and show us all how it's supposed to work.
Heck I think between the entire Lightning world we could pitch in and get you a plane ticket! This way you can show us all how we are incapable of doing your installation right. Further, you cans show these guys that bought your superior kit what they paid for!
What say you Lightning world?
What say you Racetested?
God Bless,
Jeronimo (Suavy
Here is a thought Race tested, why don't you take the time to come out to a Rob02's or a Fast Gators truck that have your kit installed wrong. Show them how it's supposed to be and show us all how it's supposed to work.
Heck I think between the entire Lightning world we could pitch in and get you a plane ticket! This way you can show us all how we are incapable of doing your installation right. Further, you cans show these guys that bought your superior kit what they paid for!
What say you Lightning world?
What say you Racetested?
God Bless,
Jeronimo (Suavy
#54
11-11-2005 | 06:58 PM
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From: S. JERSEY
Originally Posted by Suavy
Here is a thought Race tested, why don't you take the time to come out to a Rob02's or a Fast Gators truck that have your kit installed wrong. Show them how it's supposed to be and show us all how it's supposed to work.
Maybe they could tune it in,at each's respected tuner (JDM & PSP).
#55
11-11-2005 | 07:04 PM
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From: MA
Guys, go easy on these Brits...
I think they are still sore that their prince married a horse!
Just stirring the pot. Its a shame that the RT kit is experiancing problems, the theory seems awsome, and it has always apeared that they stand behind thier product. I hope you guys settle things and everyone ends up happy!
I think they are still sore that their prince married a horse!
Just stirring the pot. Its a shame that the RT kit is experiancing problems, the theory seems awsome, and it has always apeared that they stand behind thier product. I hope you guys settle things and everyone ends up happy!
#56
11-11-2005 | 07:09 PM
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From: NY
)
#57
11-11-2005 | 07:57 PM
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From: Selden NY
Since mine blew up Friday it may be a month or three before I can take you up on the offer, but hell ya you can count me in.
But next time my new motor lets lose, someone has to pay for it
Eww Eww I know, I say it's Gators turn,
I use to joke about eating cat food in a trailer up in the mountains for retirement, THAT CHIT AINT NO JOKE NO MORE.
At this rate I may have to marry an ole fling of mine who's got a ton of money to make sure that dont happen &*@$%(&@$%(@$%(@$%^@$
(btw, Thanks for the kind words Sport)
But just to make sure WE ARE ALL on the same page,
THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH MY INSTALLATION PERIOD.
However I do have to say that just maybe these Dyno #'s (for whatever reason) really aint showing us the real deal. No one can deny I was out there running 11 after 11 after 11 with the RT kit on the stock block with a 4+2+Ported Eaton. "AND" this was done for two years with JLP tuning me through the mail (my truck NEVER had a Dyno tune in it's life before the built motor) Not in the 3 years of racing it (BTW ON THE SAME SET OF PLUGS FOR 02,03,and 04)
When Sal had his Grand Opening he had a Special for 1 dyno pull (not tune)
for $50.00. I took that deal and we put down 501/615 with a AF in the 9's,
the highest it ever went during the pull was 10.2 (this is the old stock block)
This was on a 75 shot, pretty got dam good #'s if you asked me
Now that we leaned it out and tuned it to a 11.8 AF, (just so we could put down the numbers on the Dyno) one has to wonder if that played a part in Fri's bye bye motor...... : o (
Maybe as D has said all along, (for whatever reason, and I sure dont have an answer) this Kit doesn't put it down on the dyno, but does on the 1320 ????
IT SURE DID ON MY STOCK BLOCK, maybe by leaning it out and doing what we did, we're hurting it more than helping it.....
All I know is I'm out of motors and will have to do some re-thinking myself.
Whats important is, the Mag put it down, it's in the 10's. Jim Charles and Gator did it, and now my truck is being cloned pretty dam close to that set up. SO I'M FEELING PRETTY GOT DAM EXCITED ABOUT THE POSSIBILITIES FOR ME NEXT SEASON
But next time my new motor lets lose, someone has to pay for it
Eww Eww I know, I say it's Gators turn,
I use to joke about eating cat food in a trailer up in the mountains for retirement, THAT CHIT AINT NO JOKE NO MORE.
At this rate I may have to marry an ole fling of mine who's got a ton of money to make sure that dont happen &*@$%(&@$%(@$%(@$%^@$
(btw, Thanks for the kind words Sport)
But just to make sure WE ARE ALL on the same page,
THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH MY INSTALLATION PERIOD.
However I do have to say that just maybe these Dyno #'s (for whatever reason) really aint showing us the real deal. No one can deny I was out there running 11 after 11 after 11 with the RT kit on the stock block with a 4+2+Ported Eaton. "AND" this was done for two years with JLP tuning me through the mail (my truck NEVER had a Dyno tune in it's life before the built motor) Not in the 3 years of racing it (BTW ON THE SAME SET OF PLUGS FOR 02,03,and 04)
When Sal had his Grand Opening he had a Special for 1 dyno pull (not tune)
for $50.00. I took that deal and we put down 501/615 with a AF in the 9's,
the highest it ever went during the pull was 10.2 (this is the old stock block)
This was on a 75 shot, pretty got dam good #'s if you asked me
Now that we leaned it out and tuned it to a 11.8 AF, (just so we could put down the numbers on the Dyno) one has to wonder if that played a part in Fri's bye bye motor...... : o (
Maybe as D has said all along, (for whatever reason, and I sure dont have an answer) this Kit doesn't put it down on the dyno, but does on the 1320 ????
IT SURE DID ON MY STOCK BLOCK, maybe by leaning it out and doing what we did, we're hurting it more than helping it.....
All I know is I'm out of motors and will have to do some re-thinking myself.
Whats important is, the Mag put it down, it's in the 10's. Jim Charles and Gator did it, and now my truck is being cloned pretty dam close to that set up. SO I'M FEELING PRETTY GOT DAM EXCITED ABOUT THE POSSIBILITIES FOR ME NEXT SEASON
#58
11-11-2005 | 10:19 PM
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Originally Posted by lurker
Dude, are you serious??? 
Considering the damage other kits have caused over the years to cars and people, YES Gator's problems are minimal.
Last edited by racetested; 11-11-2005 at 10:31 PM.
#59
11-11-2005 | 10:29 PM
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For the other guys that mention we don't have a kit for the high level and can't compete, go to our advanced section and bike section where people swapping over in top classes have made big improvements compared to their multi stage systems by other brands.
As far as our reputation and products, a handful of people having minor issues compared to thousands of satisfied customers hardly qualifies us as not being proven and falling short.
End of subject as I'm as tired about these pissing matches as the next guy. The SMALL amount of people that are having problems know they can contact me at anytime for help.
As far as our reputation and products, a handful of people having minor issues compared to thousands of satisfied customers hardly qualifies us as not being proven and falling short.
End of subject as I'm as tired about these pissing matches as the next guy. The SMALL amount of people that are having problems know they can contact me at anytime for help.
#60
11-15-2005 | 08:47 AM
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Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 830
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From: Plymouth, MI
Originally Posted by racetested
Are you? A leaking valve (that leaked so slowly that nobody even knew until they weighed the bottle) is harmless and so is a bursted line as nitrous is not flammable. We will be posting videos soon of nitrous acting as an extinguisher. Fuel is what you have to worry about and not nitrous.
Considering the damage other kits have caused over the years to cars and people, YES Gator's problems are minimal.
Considering the damage other kits have caused over the years to cars and people, YES Gator's problems are minimal.
How about the guy who spends time and money prepping for a race weekend, travels (who knows how far) to the track, and then has a problem? NO BIG DEAL???
Why don't you get off your *** and travel to these customers to support YOUR kit? Apparently it would be a "minor" inconvenience to you!!!