i just read this on the grandbend motor plex web site!!!
very sad!!! i hate our government with its rulings and poor or no facts!
please read and support to save racing in canada!

http://www.grandbendmotorplex.com/08-end-of-racing

 

thats a danm shame

 

With all we know leaded fuel should be banned everywhere. Racing engines can easily be built to accomodate like like all engines are.

That also goes for Nascar with its obselete technology.

I fully support this.

 

They have known leaded fuels were bad since the late 60s. Racers have had it easy for a long time. Time to catch up with the rest of the world.

 

+1,000,000

And Nascar who portray themselves as family oriented, why can't they also become good corporate citizens by using unleaded fuel?

 

did you guys not read the article?
aviation acounts for 98.5% of the leaded fuel used in canada. 1.5% is from cars (so race and whatever).

you still think its fair to get rid of that aspect of it? or do you think they should go after the bigger polluters?

and who knows, in 20 years they will tell us something else is bad for us and we should stop doing that too....maybe we should go back to the stone age and do nothing so nothing can hurt us or be bad for us.....


i just got an e-mail back from my member or parliament though and she supports me and has sent letters to the minister of the environment!

i hate our government!!!
they do the stupidist things with out thinking because someone thought it was a good idea at the time and they don't think of the consequences to our communities!! and obviously they don't drag race!

 

No, they should go after ALL polluters not just the track.
Back in the stone ages I bet there were a lot of finger and toe injuries from all the stones that were dropped or banged together.

 

If the engines can be easily revised to run without lead, fine. But give it some phase-out time (still don't understand why the nitro guys would be affected anyway).

And for those who can't afford to make new engines, there's an easy fix. Nitro, like most nasty chemicals, comes from China. Have the slack space in the nitro containers filled with Chinese made children's toys. Just drop the toys in the fuel and wait. Voila -- leaded fuel.

 

I think you guys are jumping to way too many conclusions here.

The highest octane unleaded fuel currently available is 103. You can get 118+ octane leaded fuel. There just isn't a good enough replacement octane booster for Tetra Ethyl Lead. Methanol, a common octane booster, as well as TAME, have octane ratings of about 113. So, even if you ran pure methanol, you'd still fall short of the octane rating of commonly available leaded fuels like VP's C16. In addition, the actual energy content of methanol isn't as high as gasoline.

While I'm sure that you could probably eventually formulate a 118+octane unleaded fuel, the costs would be astronomical. Currently, VP's C16 sells for $11-12 per gallon.

Lead is also found in Top Fuel car fuel, as they don't run 100% nitromethane.

This means that those of us who've tuned for a specific octane (such as myself) will be unable to attain that HP level with unleaded. My car, for example, wouldn't be able to make the HP it currently makes without some serious re-engineering.

I really hope this does not leak over into the US. First, the amount of leaded fuel burned in America by racecars is incredibly miniscule, and second there's nothing really stopping you from getting leaded aviation fuel. This kind of bill is mainly to stop racers, not stop the use of leaded fuel.

In addition, the main reason we switched from leaded fuel is because it contaminated catalytic converters and burned up oxygen sensors, not necessarily because it polluted more. If you're running unleaded fuel in a catless car, you're still polluting nearly as much. The amount of pollution reduction from this is so close to zero it's a waste of time and taxpayer's dollars (whether Canadian or US). Forcing racers to use unleaded fuel solves nothing and just makes it more difficult to go fast.

Lastly, I think that each of you driving every day for a year probably puts out as much pollution as 10 drag racers do in a year. There just isn't very much fuel being burned here.

 

Well stated, Steve. I agree with you 100%, especially the reminder that removing tetraethyl lead was for compatibility with cats, not environmental reasons.

But I still don't understand why the current Top Fuel brew (90% nitro, 10% methanol) needs lead. These engines detonate all the way down the track, so I'm not seeing where knock control is an issue, and with rebuilds every few runs, do they need an upper cylinder lubricant?

 

Lead levels in water tables and children were increasing so it was removed from fuels, paints and many other areas. The fact that it destroyed catalytic converters just means it prevented the new emmision control systems from working the way they should to stop even more pollution.
I agree that racing is a very small contributor to the big picture. I am sure a solution can be found. It just may cost a little more. Lead was a cheap answer so nothing was done to find a better one.

 

Yep, and it was eventually replaced with MTBE, which was also found in the water table and subsequently phased out. I didn't mean to underscore the pollution of lead in the past when used extensively, but more to illustrate that with current usage levels, the difference in the impact of using unleaded vs. leaded fuel in cat-less racecars is negligible.

And that's my primary point. Canada is targeting racers needlessly. You always see ordinances and legislation that seems to vilify racers. This is similar to people buying a house near a long established racetrack, then complaining about the noise and getting ordinances and laws passed to kick out the track. Didn't you wonder why your house was 10-20% cheaper than others like it?

I'm not so sure. I wrote a paper when I was in school on flame front propagation differences between leaded race fuels and unleaded regular gasoline (mainly to disprove the fallacy that high-octane fuel was explosive) and from what I learned, there really isn't a better anti-knock agent than TEL. ETBE is currently the best thing we have, but it's still not enough to make fuels like VP's C16 feasible.

 

"EPA / NASCAR / Sunoco partner to develop unleaded racing fuel for NASCAR

NASCAR recently announced that NASCAR teams would switch to unleaded racing fuel by the start of the 2008 season. This is a significant development for NASCAR teams as they have long been the target of environmental groups. This change is possible because of a partnership between the Environmental Protection Agency, Sunoco and NASCAR.

Passenger car manufacturers began switching to unleaded racing fuel in 1971. However, the high-octane racing fuel that NASCAR teams use still contains environmentally-unfriendly lead.

NASCAR has been researching unleaded racing fuels for years but until now has never been able to find a mixture that works for race teams. Current unleaded racing fuels all caused damage to racing engines.

This switch is now possible because Sunoco researchers have come up with a new formulation called Sunoco 260 GTX. This new formula still provides great racing performance but without damaging NASCAR engines like common unleaded racing fuels do.

While many believe that this change is long overdue it really has only recently become possible due to advanced technology and research at Sunoco.

This is a true win/win situation as NASCAR is able to do its part for the environment and the EPA while protecting the quality of its on track product. The best news of all? Race fans will not even know the difference."

 

Anyone can do enough research to back up just about ANY therory. I like to take the road less traveled. Commone sense. Take a look at a satelite picture of the earth. we really havent changed much. Now relise that we are in the gravitational pull of the sun. Earth is just a temporary life provider. Its just a matter of time before we get sucked in a 1/4" closer to the sun and get turned to dust.

Untill then we can waste our time and blame things on each other and crate new monsters to scare each other and create new gods to give us some comfort

Oh dear,,,i wonder if santa is reading this

 

The Earth is warming, and increased CO2 is causing it. There is no real scientific debate on this point. Whether we are heading for a global disaster as a result, or whether the Earth can self-correct are where the intelligent debate lies.

We are polluting the Earth (the Chinese worst of all). There is no real scientific debate on this point.

Vehicle emission regulations have dramatically improved air quality -- visibly here in Los Angeles. There is no real scientific debate on this point.

When the Republicans concede these points, you know the debate has ended.

The only question is how far we need to go, and how quickly, to correct these problems. The consensus emerging seems to be that we need to address them in a much more deliberate way, and with a great deal more attention. But when planes use 98.5% of the pollutant at issue, and the 1.5% user is eliminated first, you have to question the wisdom of the litigation. Similarly, diesel trucks, which spew huge amounts of pollutants compared to cars, are just now getting cleaned up, yet cars have been emissions controlled for over three decades now.

Why?