Count me in for the upgrade kit, Sal.

Thanks,
Mike

 

Sal,

Has there been enough response to make this a go? How about price and availiability if it is?

 

Count me in for the upgrade when it is available.

Paul

 

Ribbed hosing can cause turbulence and not help to increase performance. The key is to use big enough hosing or 2 smaller hoses that would equal the size of a big hose. I believe Sal's kit wouldn't hurt performance, only gain performance, but it definitely for the right $ could be made completely smooth w/ smooth bends to get the maximum out of it. Regardless, you're going to gain power w/ this.

Now, not all ribbed hosing can cause problems like this as some pre-intake ducting are ribbed from the factory, but the longer it gets the better of a chance it has to do this. A nice smooth hose that is form fitted would really rock but that would probably require a lot of effort and time to develop right (maybe not?), and cost considerably more. One similar to a s/c kits would be nice.

I wonder if we can get any flow data on this?

BfB

 

Looks good to me, but a few questions / comments / concerns:

#1: I have a 2000 with the JDM 90mm kit on it; I know you said that a JDM FILTER is adaptable, but how does the 90mm MAF part come into play? Will different kits be available for the 99-00 versus the 01 (since it seems pretty apparent to me that people are showing sufficient interest here to make it- but that's your call i guess)? If there are different YEAR kits, would a 99/00 owner such as myself with the 90mm kit (there are many of us) just buy the "stock" 01 FASTair system, or will you offer a separate 99/00 kit specifically for guys with the 90mm (i.e. I didn't know if the mounting locations or something else may have changed).

#2: Like what DonC said, have you given any thought to mounting the intake scoop behind one of the grilles, or are there reasons its better off down low? (i.e. Do you think the loss of airflow over the radiator and other heat exchangers is enough to cause a noticable increase in heat and therefore loss of hp?)

and finally #C: Similar to what others have mentioned, you don't think that the coil tubing you're using to carry the air would cause turbulence (and loss of efficiency?). I don't know if I would go as far as to say that you'd be better off to just suck air through the fenderwell opening, but from previous experience with "similar" setups (not on cars), the smoother your intake tract the better. I would have to disagree with BfB, though, and say that using 2 smaller tubes having the same overall cross sectional area as one large tube would NOT produce the same effect. I can't quote you an actual equation, but I'm pretty sure that there is a significant difference between how the two setups would work, as a result of the boundary layers that would form along the surface area of the tubing (ratio of diameter to cross sectional area or something). How much more difficult (and more expensive) would it be to fabricate the tubes from a solid, smoother material like BfB was saying? The only thing I could see that would preclude you from doing this might be the loss of adjustability you were talking about, but if it is only adjustable for ~1-2 inches, you could have your flexible tubing or equivalent just at the scoop.

Just some thoughts to consider, but your answers and reasoning behind your design approach (which I like) would be appreciated...That, and of course how much (jk). Thanks Sal (and others), later...

 

Heh, I should have clarified myself a bit more. I was driving along a lil while ago and thought that someone would point this out, and WHAM Good going.

What I did say was:

Although I was meaning what I'm about to say I'm going to reword that statement and go with this:

The key is to use big enough hosing or 2 smaller hoses that are large enough to overcome the deficiencies, this way you'll have cool dense air not only from the fender but also from the front when needed or not needed. Sal uses two 3-inch tubes which is plenty large enough if you ask me.

I do think, Sal, that you should design the front tubing to be blocked off somehow, preferably at the air box for safety, so those who do not want to use it when it rains could do such.

BfB

 

Bubba:

Take a look at the link to Sal's site. This isn't a pressurized ram-air system, and Sal is making no claims that it is. It's rigged to blow non-under-hood air onto an aftermarket CONICAL filter.

Hence, no airbox (referred to in your post), and realistically no way for water to be forced into the intake.

Now, if you really want to force water at high pressure into the intake via the OEM airbox, wait until I post the photos and results from the sealed ram-air system I'm building. That's a high-pressure water-forcing stainless steel mother-humper if there EVER was one.

 

I know this. I never referred to it as a pressurized system. What makes you think that?

Simple misuse of words. But there still is some danger of extra moisture getting into the system, and if it all of a sudden comes a flooding then you're looking at scooping it up. This is rare, but it has happened.

Upon taking further looks at the system I notice both tubes go to the front. Sal, or anyone else, is there a provision for the fender opening as well? I think from reading up that there still is.

What I was stating is that it would be nice and easy if one was able to close off the frontal openings when desired.

BfB

 

Bubba:

If you hit a puddle SEVERAL inches deep (at least to the bottom of the scoop) at a velocity high enough to FORCE water all the way up to the conical (recognize that the intake will NOT pull any measurable vacuum in the tube), a little water in the intake will be the VERY LEAST of your worries. Being ripped limb-from-limb as your $31,000 standard-cab pickup cartwheels through the median will likely occupy your thoughts at that time.

I could do the calculations (stagnation pressure, pressure head from scoop to intake), but it's acdemic and frankly a waste of time. You're not going to get any water up those tubes to the filter, not to mention through the filter, through the MAF, and into the 'charger.

Please don't take this, by the way, as an endoesement for the product. Frankly, I think it's a design that has little to offer (although a slight improvement over a simple under-hood conical). I just think (strongly, at that) that there's nothing to fear as far as forcing water up the intake goes. Sure, you could get the water there (wind it up to a buck-twenty through downtown Fairhope and run it straight off the pier into the bay, for example), but not in any way that you would have a good chance of surviving.

If you're still worried, either rig one up yourself that has a cut-out capability, or run Sal's unit up to your local machinist for modification. I know a good old boy up in Axis that would probably do the job in exchange for a case of Red Dog.

 

BfB, this is starting to become like a game of tennis (so now comes the question...would you rather be Ivanisevich and win...or Patrick Rafter and have the Brooke Burke looking hot girlfriend...jk). anyways...

I've actually mentioned similar ideas regarding how the "ram" air system should be able to be readily be blocked off to prevent rain and other things (like excessive dust at the MX track in my case) from getting up in there. Personally though, I'm not convinced that having the "shut-off valve" under the hood is the best solution to the problem. The way I figure it, if its raining and you don't want water to get UP to your filter...then popping the hood wide open to get at the valve doesn't seem like the best idea, since water would be pouring DOWN on it the whole time the hood is open...plus, being the little sissy mary that I am, I'd want to spend as little time in the rain MYSELF getting wet.

The best answer I've come up with is to have a "cap" actually down at the front of the scoop, as opposed to at the "airbox" under the hood. Let's say you're looking at the left side front of the truck, and imagine that the front face of the intake scoop is somewhat vertical (6 or 7 o'clock position). If you designed the cap so that it opened past the horizontal (say to about a 10 o'clock position), then in the fully open position (in theory anyways), it would help "funnel" more air into the scoop, and as far as I'm concerned- the more air the better.

The trick lies in how you keep the cap open or closed though. I have a couple of ideas on this one, both involving a spring and a magnet. One way I see it, since the cap will be open 90% of the time, you want the stronger of the two methods I've mentioned to keep it open so that it wouldn't accidently shut if you hit a bump in the road (for example). But then there's the other side that says the small 10% of the time that it would be closed due to rain or dust- you'd want it to STAY closed...so you should use the stonger of the two for that. Another thing to consider is the ease with which you can close it (which is the only reason I didn't say use something as foolproof as a clip...since personally I wouldn't want to fuddle with something like that in a shirt and tie in the rain. Right now I'd say that having the cap so it spring loaded shut against some sort of inexpensive rubber "gasket" along the leading edges of the scoop would be the best setup (to cover the important 10% you want it shut and don't want to get wet yourself- so you could just reach under and "flick it" shut), and having something like a decently strong magnet hold it open to about ~10 o'clock is the best design I can come up with.

So thats my 3 cents on the matter (cause its definitely more than just $.02). What do you guys think...am I way off base here?...what are your thoughts or opinions??? later...

 

SAL, have you came up with a price and ship date?

Oscar,

 

Sal, will it work with the Pro-M 80mm Mass air and Filter combo?

If so, I'm interested. I have been experimenting with my own, but was shrouding the air filter and only using the opening in the fender as the air supply. slight loss of performance was noticed even though cooler air was injested .

 

For those of you worried about wate getting into the intake, I just rigged up Johnny Lightnings scoop with a 3" diameter tube to the bottom of my airbox. While traveling to the track I just used a car sponge to plug the tube. No water, no bugs and easy to install and remove.

 

We will have an update on this shortly. Thank you