You could definitely work the shift solenoids manually. The only problem I forsee with doing this, is the conflict with the PCM. The PCM monitors all electronic trans functions, and if something does something not commanded by the PCM, it sees it as a failure and will go into limp mode. Now you can shut the trans portion of the calibration off with a chip, but the downside to that is you'd have to upshift and downshift the truck manually ALL the time.

 

slightly off-topic, but how about a stand-alone box just for the tranny. Then you could use this transmission in a car that was not intended to have it. Say I don't a '69 Cougar.

Just a thought. could it be done?

oh and another thing. How about converting the transmission to full manual and create a set of paddle shifters that mounted to the steering wheel (ala IS300). Then you could manual shift the tranny. If I could get have that I would sign up tomorrow.

 

Ok... where I work we have programable logic controllers (PLCs). They are programable devices with several inputs and outputs. They are super flexible. You can make any input turn on any output. You can kind of think of them as a bunch of programable relays.

What if i tied all of the outputs from the pcm that go to the tranny, to the plc instead. Then have outputs from the plc to the solenoids on the tranny. I coud then have an "automatic mode" in which everything would operate the same as it does now, and sort of "feed through" the plc. When the pcm tries to energize a solenoid, instead it turns on an input to the plc, which inturn turns on an output and shifts the tranny. That part would be pretty siimple. Now for the manual mode:

I had wondered about the pcm getting "feedback" from the trans, and if that would set a fault code. Here is one thought on how to deal with that: First of all, what info does the trans send to the pcm? If it is just telling it what gear it is in, you could take the outputs going from the pcm that are going to the plc (the ones I was talking about at the top of the previous paragraph) and pick up an output and send it back to the pcm. So what ever gear the pcm is telling the trans to be in, the plc would tell the pcm it was in that gear, in effect "fooling" the pcm.
Back to auto mode for a second. The wire sending the feedback from the trans to the pcm could be tied to the plc, so when in auto mode, it would still tell the pcm which gear it was in.

AM I MAKING ANY SENSE???

Anyhow... if the inputs and outputs between the trans and pcm are all digital (on or off). The possibilities are endless. If there ane any analog signals (like if the pcm is varying pressure on a scale or range, or if the trans is telling the pcm how much pressure or something) Things could get pretty tricky. I hate to fry something, I just think it would be really handy.

Thanks for all the input, keep it coming!!

 

There is a company that makes a stand alone transmission controller, and it's a darn good one, let me see if I can find them, I'll have to dig around. It's pricey, I think they go for about a grand wholesale, but I'll check. If you decide you want one of them, my supplier carries them so I can get one, I'll do it for my cost if you're interested. It's made for just what you mentioned, someone building an old car without a PCM and wants to use a new tranny.

G

 

OK Thanks!!!

Anyone heard of this?
http://www.baumannengineering.com/tcs.htm

They dont show one for a 4r100, just an e4od, arent they pretty much the same? I emailed them, I will post when I find something out. I looks pretty cool though.

Here is the thread on the diesel stop about this if anyone is interested. Thanks


http://forums.thedieselstop.com/ubbt...=1#Post1472175

 

well I havent heard back from bauman, does anyone have any experience with them?

Gregg, did you find anything?

Thanks

 

Let's keep the thread alive! I am definitely in the market for a manual shift kit. Even if that means buying a $2,000 Gear Vendors overdrive!

 

I've given this a considerable amount of thought but didn't realize that there were as many others that would be interested.

I don't see where it would be difficult to do with a few relays and a pushbutton panel, just have to design the circuit so that there is no way to engage two gears at once.

There are times when I would like to be able to hold it in second so that I could go down all the way and not have it downshift back to first, just use the low end torque without all of the hoopla associated with a downshift.

Based on what I read here, there just might be more of a market than I thought.

 

The motorhome has a 6 speed allison transmision, that you can have it downshift into any gear you want, would anything like that ever work in the L's?

 

I'm really interested in this as well. Didn't think I would be until we picked up an AT RX-8 a little over a week ago. The manual shift mode really enhances the driving experience and made the car much more interesting in the twisties (I think I may be a convert now).

Since the L and the RX-8 share the same PCM (at least I believe they do), then the logic must exist to control it manually. Granted, the trannys are way different, but the i/f controls have to exist.

Am I just way off in thinking this?

BTW, the steering wheel mounted paddle controls are the way to go in terms of user interface. Very friendly.

--Rip

 

Hey Guys-

Just talked to http://www.baumannengineering.com/tcs.htm about the using their E4OD controller:

Mr. Baumann stated that the controller would work IF we can have our tuner disable the transmission control aspect of the ECU.

Apparently, He has not tested at all with a L. So we would be "blazing new ground" according to him.

The unit retails for $425.00 and an additional $75.00 for the electronic/volt splitter box.

I did NOT ask if this "mod" would nulify the automatic aspect of our tranni, ie if you would always have to manual shift.

After I call JL, I will post more.

See ya,

Andy

 

What is the electronic/volt splitter box?
I am sure I could build something with a PLC that would work if I 100% understood how the transmissions amd pcms work together, and had a detailed wiring diagram. However the PLC I would use to build it from isnt much if any cheaper than the baumann controller. Plus there might be some trial and error envolved, that could prove to be costly.

What is the difference between an e4od and a 4r100? Could you have a chip burned to disable the auto trans controll, then run an e4od pcm as a stand alone unit with the baumann unit? That might let you have auto or manual shift. It would be nice to have both.

 

If I understand the information that I have been given, correctly, there are a total of nine wires that go to the plug on the passenger side of the trans that control the gear selection.

Three of them control shift solenoids. It is the presence or absence of 5VDC on a one or more of these solenoids that selects each gear.

If this is the case, it should be possible to design a system using relays and pushbuttons that will control the correct combination of solenoids to control gear selection. As I have said before, the trick will be to design it in such a way that it is impossible to select two gears at once, ouch. Much of this information is available in the ATRA troubleshooting handbooks

Somebody who has access to the proper onboard diagnosic tools should be able to tell us which solenoids control which gear and whether thay need to be energized or de-energized to do so.

I have a bud who has a trans shop. He has about 10 grand worth of diagnostic equipment,,,,,,,,,,maybe someday.

I would be willing to bet that somebody who works very near to Gregg Evans would be able to give us the answers without skipping a beat.

(hey Gregg, where are you?)

 

It appears that manual and fully automatic modes are switchable at will:

"Allows tunability of ALL transmission shift points, line pressure curve and torque converter clutch operation.
Transmission durability and drivability rivaling that of OEM electronics or older non-electronic transmissions.
ManuTronic feature allows fully manual gear selection when desired, via OEM Ford speed control buttons or a stand-alone push-button control."

"The ManuTronic function allows manual gear selection via the original equipment speed control (cruise control) switches. This feature allows up and down-shifting through all four gears at any time, using the Accel and Coast buttons located on the steering wheel."

I've got wood. I want this NOW.

4.10 gears, a Gear Vendors Overdrive, and steering wheel shifting. Pinch me -- I think I'm dreaming.

 

A little pricey but man that sounds really cool.

Who's going to step up and be the guinea pig?