What page does it say that?

 

There's a sucker born every minute (and I know where a few hang out) Remember Slick 50, Dura-lube, Wynns Friction Proofing, Motor Honey and the famous STP. If these were all as good as advertised we all would have million mile engines. I do not know much about Seafoam but the proof will be known if engines last longer with it's use. Do you think your dealer would help you if your engine failed after 35,999 miles and a recent engine flush????? Engine flushes are easy money and a good way to fleece fools and if that doesn't work they now have a chance to sell you a new engine or a new vehicle. I can just hear the factory rep when you tell him the dealer does engine flushes so they must be safe.

 

Interesting posts - on one hand some stand behind dealer shops, and some others swear at them for what they do. I suggest that you start out by asking the manufacture of the engine cleaner what they will stand behind should you get a leaky seal as a result of using the solvent/cleaner. I would get a refund, unless you want to run the risk. Again as someone else said: If it isn't broke, don't try and fix it.

 

If you change your oil and filter regularly, there's no "flushing" necessary...and if you don't, you shouldn't be looking into any silly *** engine flushes - some of that sludge and other stuff is probably holding seals together. Don't mess with it.

Change your oil and filter regularly with good stuff, and your engine will give you all it can without snake oil cures-in-a-can.

 

Steve really is 100% right, he usually is.

Flushing really is a necessary maintenance procedure that really needs to be done. However, where most people run into problems is trying to flush a motor for the very first time at 200k miles because they are having a problem (knock, tick, etc.) and they are hoping the flush will fix it.

It doesn't work that way.

For flushing to be effective it needs to be done on a regular basis, and that basis needs to start with a clean engine. Think about it. Do you only brush your teeth when the plaque and goo is an inch thick, or do you do it 2, 3 times a day...... every day? Well, waiting for some problem to develop and trying to fix it with a flush will invariably lead to more problems.

If you have a motor that is just FILLED with S^^T, the flush will knock it loose, clog up your oil screen, etc. If your motor is so old and gummed up that the metal has literally worn away to provide clearance because of the buildup, what was a tight motor will now be loosy-goosy. This is something that was paramount with the old 2 stroke motorcycles running castor based 2 stroke oil. It was the BEST lubricant there was, PERIOD. However, you would have to pull the motor apart from time to time and clean out the crap that was left behind from the castor burning. If you waited until something went wrong before you did that, or you just flat put it off, when you finally did clean it out and put it back together, your motor was GONE and required a top-end job, new bearings, the works. But if you cleaned out the deposits AS THEY FORMED, they would run forever! I had a KDX 250 that ran 8 THOUSAND MILES worth of enduro racing and NEVER EVER NEVER needed a top-end job EVER! That's insane! That doesn't sound all that far, but on a dirt bike, racing through trees, rivers, sand, etc, that's YEARS!!! Most of the time you would have to put a new jug, piston, and rings, almost ever year, two years at the most. But if you ran castor, and kept it clean, it would run forever.

These truck engines aren't a whole lot different in that regard. Combustion byproducts will always make it past the rings and settle in the oil. This carbon, sludge, etc. will eventually be deposited on the surface in the engine. regardless of how often you change your oil. This will continue to happen with gas engines from now till the end of time. PCV helps keep this at bay, and somewhat retard the process, but you have to turn the engine of some time. And when you do, what was in the air in the crankcase will settle.

If you flush the motor regularly, you can stay on top of the buildup. But you have to start flushing before there really is any buildup. If you don't, and it gets really bad, flushing will only cause problems. If you ever, AND I MEAN EVER, severely overheat your engine, don't you ever flush it again after that.

And the flush itself, it's just petroleum distillate. It's no worse for your seals and gaskets than gasoline is. On small engines, what do you think we clean them with? Gas! If gas was so caustic, how do you think the o-rings on your injectors last longer than the engine does? Or what about rubber fuel lines? Plastic gas-tanks? Head gaskets? Well? The only way flush will do any damage beyond knocking 15 years worth of crap loose in a crap filled motor is from leaving it in there and continuing to run the engine for any amount of time longer than the flush takes. That's bad! It's very volitile stuff and evaporates quite rapidly at room temp. The tiny amount that's still in the crankcase after the oil change will evaporate from the oil in a very short period of time at operating temp (20-30 minutes at most).

 

I think if you've got enough junk built up in the engine to where you'd consider flushing it, you've got other problems (quality of oil, maintenance schedules, driving habits, etc.) you should address before "flushing" it out.

Stay on top of basic maintenance, using quality products, and leave the flushes on the shelf at your favorite parts store.

 

What do you think the detergent and other additives are in the oil for, they keeps sludge from forming and carbon and other debris suspended in the oil so the filter will pick it up. Any engine that has had oil changed regularly with good oil will never need flushed. When is there too many miles to use a flush, after all it ain't like being " almost pregnant" I've seen the insides of hundreds of engines and the only ones that could have benefited from flushing would also have resulted in total engine destruction by unleashing this crap into the oil system. Send an e-mail to the manufacturer of your engine flush and ask what they will do to replace your seals and engine if failure occured. Now hold your breath until the check arrives. I read this web site almost everyday and if "Quintin" or "Bubbadewsky" says it---you can take it to the bank

 

That or you bought a 4.6. Gooey little bastards.

Most people haven't seen any further into an engine than the dipstick. I don't expect everyone to feel the same or think like I do. But I have built and rebuilt hundreds of engines over the years and know what works and what doesn't. I'm sure there are many others on here that have as well (Steve for example, and many others). We can share our experience so others can learn from it, or they can argue, I don't give 2 s^^ts either way. It doesn't matter to me one little bit what you do with _your_ engine. If you drain all the oil and coolant from it and race it around until it blows up, I won't loose sleep over it.

Take it or leave it, I couldn't care less.

 

Fill 'er up with Dura-Lube , drain it and with our fail-safe cooling systems we don't need oil or coolant. And everyone knows we can race our FAST FORDS. WOW that seems like a great idea.

 

Obviously you do care, otherwise you wouldn't have went into that goofy tirade.

Here's the bottom line - Ford's official stance on any type of oil additive or flush is a big, fat NO. With today's oil in terms of detergent and additive packages, with relatively clean operating engines, if properly maintained from the start, there is no reason whatsoever to flush/clean/purge - whatever you want to call it - your engine. Period.

Hundreds, maybe thousands of Ford vehicles, from Aspires to Zephyrs, from rinky-dink 1.6 liter four poppers to 6.8 liter 3V V10s (and a handful of diesels in between), from grandma's little ol' Town Car that gets driven about ten miles a week to and from church, to the local police department's Crown Vic Interceptors - several that have six digit odometer readings - that see more WOT and extended idle time than most any of us do, that have passed through my hands has shown me that basic, regular maintenance - minus the snake oil flushes - will see to it that your engine gives you all it can in terms of reliability and longevity.

BG, Wynns, STP, etc., they're all out to sell their product, not to keep your vehicle running. Reading some of the posts in this thread, it's obvious that their Kool Aid is very good.

ETA - And my personal experience? I've got a '97 5.4 liter with 183K miles on it without ever using a single flushing product whatsoever. At 110Kish, I had to replace a cylinder head because a spark plug popped. There wasn't a lick of sludge or crud in the valve covers, timing cover, or down in the crankcase. It doesn't knock, doesn't smoke, doesn't leak, doesn't burn a drop of oil between changes, using any oil I had my hands on at the particular time, from 99 cent value store crap to Mobil 1 Synthetic and most anything else in between.

 

To me this is a very simple subject. It's all about the $$$. Notice the first name in the title in "Service Department". They make money by performing service. Things like engine flushing are highly profitable. Dump in $3.00 worth of chemical, run it for 5 minutes, change the oil, and charge $39.95.

I agree some engines to sludge more than other, but it is not an issue on most modern engines if the oil is changed reguarly. My 4.6 has never been flushed, gets the oil changed every 5,000-8,000 miles, has over 300,000 miles, and shows no signs of quiting any time soon.

 

MattNewHampshir, your original question was will a quick flush hurt anything. The quick type flushes are a solvent that work by breaking down the viscosity of the oil as well as the lubricity. The thinner fluid at temp will "melt" the sludge and deposits and wash them into the oil. Yours would not be the first engine to suffer scuffing or blockage of oil passages from debris turning loose during the flushing. I would never suggest any one, regardless of the condition of the engine, use one of these quicky flushes. If you think the engine might have a build up of sludge or deposits, I would suggest using a dual rated oil like Motorcraft Diesel 10w-30 or any diesel rated oil in the same viscosity range. These oils have the ability to do more cleaning and hold the deposits in suspension longer so that the trash is trapped in the filter. They also work slowly so as not to create more problems. You could also use a product known as Auto-Rx. It is ester based like the esters used in some synthetic oils and cleans slowly. You can also use a synthetic diesel rated oil as an additive such as 1 qt Amsoil 5w-30 HDD with your favorite brand of oil in 5w-30. The combination will yield an oil mix that will slowly clean and not strip the engine. Which ever way you decide to go, don't use the the quicky flushes, your engine will thank you.

www.auto-rx.com
http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/hdd.aspx
http://www.fordpowerproducts.com/products.do?item=15

Hope this is helpful info for you.

 

nnnnnnnnnope

 

I think that's a slight exaggeration... So then don't change your oil or filters until the engine goes bad, right? That mentality is RETARDED! Yeah - let's wait for things to BREAK before doing anything about it because we all know that REPAIR is cheaper than MAINTENANCE.At least you're honest enough to qualify your opinion! So you're just going to WAIT until it DOES show signs of wearing out?

 

I only mean that by reading thousands of posts, it's easy to see who knows what they are talking about and who doesn't. But like something else, everyone has an opinion