Todd, I would agree with you except here is my question. I have spent countless hours and dollars replacing rotors, calipers, lubing guide pins, bleeding brakes, making sure the job was done to perfection over and over again. I spend the time and follow break in procedures to the tee every time I still warp rotors in 6k-9k every single time. I could theoreticly go thru two rotors to a pad. If it is not lug torqing, what else could it possibly be?

 

Todd my friend you are right and wrong.

You are right when it comes to TWO WHEEL DRIVE trucks. You can torque them any way you want.

You are absolutely wrong when it comes to 4X4's (And modern front wheel drive cars for that matter) 4X4's have "Doughnut" rotors and they are very thin at the point where they meet the hub and rim and can be bent/warped very easily. Remember we are only talking hundreths of an inch to cause runout.

A friend did not tell me this it is a known fact on MODERN vehicles. There are countless TSB's on the matter.

 

Thats is why the lug nuts have a torque spec and proper sequence of torqueing in the first place: So that you don't break the lug bolts and also so the force is ditributed evemnly across the rotor so that the rotors do not warp. You CANNOT just tighten them down in the order of 1-2-3-4-5 if you went in a clockwise direction.

It should be done something like 1-3-5-2-4 in a criss cross pattern if that makes sense Heck Ford even sent me a letter about it a few years back.

Richard D.

WHILE YOUR HERE CHECK OUT MY GALLERY:
https://www.f150online.com/galleries....cfm?gnum=2479

 

I confess to not having experience to state the facts on the 4WD parts in question regarding "warped due to imporper torque of the wheel". Still, I'll stand by the basis of my comment that simply installing the lug nuts with an impact will not cause the rotor to warp premature.

Granted my comments are more related to the 2WD crowd.

As for why the gent above continues to warp rotor etc over and over....well I hate to say it, but it's the way you drive/use them. It's heat, too much of it, not enough cool down, improper pad choice and most likely simply applying more brake than needed on a regular basis.

Some tips;

NO RACE PADS for the street! The high Cf will help slow the truck faster but with greater heat generated. Those fancy bling pads you bought are likely the cause of some of the problems.

Different year trucks have different piston areas too. This means no matter how hard you try (and cause more problems) you won't get an older truck to match the brake torque of the later ones with out some compromise.

When using excessive braking (hoping you know what that is) you need to get your FOOT OFF the pedal after you stop! Or at leat creep the vehicle to prevent hot spot. (this is the same problem I have on SHO brake kits on Automatic SHOs!) It's simple: the more you work it, the hotter it gets, the more it needs to cool.

Lastly, when fitting new pads (as I did today in fact on my '02, impact gun and all!) you need to let the pads and rotors get friendly with one another for at some time before hard braking (and cool down time) or you'll likely cause a material transfer you'll hate later.

If wondering, I put some Autozone suppplied PFCs on it on all four corners. Yup, did some bedding on the back streets and can say for sure they bite better. BUT I also know that if I abuse this benefit of added Cf I'll be paying the price as many of you do. And no, I'm not going to blame it on the impact gun. Or even the channel locks I used to push back the pistons....lol.

 

Todd, tell me more about carbon fiber. I thought a cf pad was easier on rotors than a semi metallic?

Thanks

Frank

 

I would also like to say that the things Todd has said about proper bedding in are right on the money and you should be very gentle on your brakes for at least the first 500 miles "NO HARD BRAKING" or so when installing any new pads and/or rotors. You also need to get the rotors and pads bedded to each other by getting the truck up to about 35MPH and then lightly braking to a stop wich will heat the brakes up and make a good transfer film between the pads and rotors. You should do that about 10-15 times and make sure to let the brakes cool down a bit in between stops. What you are doing is heating the rotos and pads up to get a good film transfer. Then be easy on those brakes.

Richard D.

WHILE YOUR HERE CHECK OUT MY GALLERY:
https://www.f150online.com/galleries....cfm?gnum=2479

 

Ok enough about the idea that the rotors are being warped by the lug nuts or not. I don't buy into that idea anyway. As for front wheel drive cars having thinner rotors and being able to be warped that way, I haven't seen it and I have owned several front wheel drive cars that i only replaced the rotors on once and 2 of them I know still have the same rotors that I installed several years ago after having many shops torque with the impact. so like I said enough already. The Question still stands about what rotors and pads will work well together and reduce if possible the likely hood if the rotors warping? I am also verey interested in this as I have 83000 miles on my 98 and I am still on the factory rotors with the third set of pads on the front. I brake hard and that has warped my rotors over winter and I am getting sick if the pulsing it causes when stopping. One easy way to tell that the heat is what is warping the rotors, look at them. If they are discolored then you are toasting them from braking hard or from a caliper problem causing constant pressure on the rotor. Also I would have to agree if you've been driving don't wash the wheels! Lets see take one hot rotor and hit it with room temp water, the metal of the rotor could easily warp from this uneven temperature change. No disrespect to anyone else, I just would really like to get back on topic and help the guy out with his question, as well as my own interests, and stop debating how rotors can get warped. So who wants to comment on the rotor and pad combonations?

 

Well speedy for your truck there are many available so you can get what you want. I myself have Powerslot rotors and HAWK HP Light Duty Trcuk pads and they seem to be working very well together with the exception of some squeling when doing light braking.So there you go. Over torquing though will in fact warp rotors lets say you only put 80 ft lbs on two lug nuts and then for the other three you put 120 ft lbs don't you think that will casue the rotor to skew and warp which will be exageratted by heat.

Richard D.

WHILE YOUR HERE CHECK OUT MY GALLERY:
https://www.f150online.com/galleries....cfm?gnum=2479

 

I don't argue that overtorqueing could cause a problem with wrping, I simply haven't seen proof of it in application. On paper you can make an elephant can fly, however I know better as reality is it's impossible. I'm not saying that is in impossible for them to warp from overtorqueing, just that I haven't seen, or know anyone who has seen this actually happen.

As for the power slot rotors, I was thinking about getting them already and the only thing that I was wondering is wouldn't a sloted rotor cause the rotor to wear the pad down faster? Just a thought, would welcome any opinions on this as I've never used slotted rotors. I know that the idea is to help cool the rotor to keep it from warping. Also with a slotted rotor do you end up haveing to replace it sooner as it is unable to be turned or have I been misinformed?

 

I am currently running NAPA Ceramix pads and the best (stock) Wagner rotors I could buy. In less than 10,000 miles I have at least 1 warped rotor again. I am beginning to wonder after all I have read if the pads are too hard for the rotors. Any thoughts on this combo?

99 F150 XLT 2WD.

Thanks

 

I see no reason for a slotted rotor wearing pads down faster the slots are sunk in and when they pass over the pad they simply help vent gases wehn applying th brakes which helps keep temps down. as far as turning them goes I have heard that you can turn certain slotted rotors but that NO drilled rotors can be turned If memeory serves me corrctly the Powerslots are mad out of a much heavier duty metal than OEM rotors which is also a benifit with regard to warpage. The best thjing to do is go to www.powerslot.com and read up on there site also doa s earch on slotted rotors you should geta fewq other sites that have good info then you can make your decision from there. By the way the least expensive place that I have found the Powerslot rotors is at www.truckperformance.com and I got the HAWK pads at www.tirerack.com

Richard D.

 

Thanks for the info. I'll do some reading and see how things go.

 

Just to set the record straight my first reply to this post WAS the rotor and pad combo that I use and no mention of what causes warping!

other people here have perpetuated the debate of what causes rotor warping. Just because they have not seen it on their vehicles. I know that you know there are millions of other vehicles out there and that TSB's (Paper in your words) are only written when the concern/problem is seen many many times in real life.

I am sorry for my soap box retort but my patience wears thin when it comes to such closed minded thinking.


Now for you it sounds that the best rotor/pad combo is all stock since that is what has worked for you so I suggest that is what you use.

 

I respectfully disagree with Todd on this one. I've personally performed thousands of brake jobs as well as been around 10's of thousands of tires being replaced. Improperly torqued wheels can cause rotors to warp. I've seen it, I've been there and I've watched my mechanics do it. I've also had to stand behind it when we've screwed up. It happens, period!

 

We'll have to agree to disagree, but I'd bet that the problems showed up mostly on those cars which had brake service preformed. Not on cars which simply had the wheels removed. The rotor doesn't know why you removed the wheel, why would it 'warp' on only selected applications?

I stand by the simple statement that heat, improper bedding (did the shop or customer do it?) and the simple fact that most people want 'bettter brakes' but dont' realize that the trade off is more heat that needs to be properly managed. (Regardless of how the wheel was put on)

The increase in Cf by the 'high end' pads DO stop a car/truck better, but they also do it with added heat and wear.

As for gas slots, yes they will wear the pad faster (had them on my own SHO for years and hated the dust) as well as venting material as stated. It's as simple as it gets; apply pressure to a rotor with your finger while its turning, I'll bet you lose skin! Granted the finger is softer than the pad. Well most of them anyhow.

As for Carbon FIBER pads; the PFCs are not CARBON FIBER, they are Carbon Metalic. CF only works on Carbon rotors and none of us can afford those. Or we wouldn't be here talking about trucks!

Enough anyhow. Tighten your wheels as suites your taste. Peace.

Forgtot to mention; the term 'warp' is a generic one, often its a matter of differnet things causing the same 'feel'. Also, there is no 'best combo' on all of this. If there were you'd have gotten it from Ford.